Did his friend, the Scotch Captain, forget the sale by his own countrymen of Charles the First? (Loud laughter.) Mr. Kenny had thought proper to vent his mirth upon the misfortune of Mr. Carroll.-How soon the parson undertook to roast the priest when he had him once on the spit; with what pious rancour he turned him round, and delighted in the popish dripping! The parson should not court a comparison with the priest. Where was the parson found? He was a shepherd that visited his flock at shearing time. Where was the priest? At the side of the bed of straw, impregnated with typhus, and perform the duties of his sacred religion with infection and death about him. Mr. O'Connell then entered into the argument upon the distribution of the Bible, and referred to Scripture and to the authority of the Fathers with great felicity, to establish his tenets. Mr. Pope followed Mr. O'Connell, and said, it was a mistake to suppose that such a variety of belief existed in England. There might be a shade, of difference, but the same great body of Christians and Scriptural truth was to be found in the diversities of each. He strongly condemned the language in which Mr. Sheil had spoken of the impropriety of allowing women to read the Scriptures. He was greatly mistaken if he supposed that the word of God was the source of sensual thought, however his own imagination might throw poison into the sacred springs of holy truth. In no class could the reading of the Bible be attended with such results as he had described: much less among the lower orders, whose fancy was not so excitable as that of the learned gentleman. The phraseology of the Canticle of Canticles was undisguised, but not impure. But there was no expression in it which could alarm the modesty of the humble tenants of the Irish cottage. Mr. Pope referred to several texts in Scripture to show the necessity of distributing the sacred writings among all classes of the community. Mr. Bric said, reluctant as he would be at any time to trespass upon public attention, he was still more unwilling to do so on the present occasion. The very advanced hour of the day-the presence of gentlewomen-the exhausted state of these, as well as of others, rendered, he feared, further discussion not very acceptable to many of those whom he had the honour to address; but he would say, that feeling a deep interest in the awful business before the meeting-feeling as a Catholic and as an honest man, that the object of those by whom the meeting was got up, was to pervert the minds of the Catholic children-to take them away from the religion of their ancestors-conceiving this scheme as pregnant with danger and misfortune, he would, at whatever hazard, contribute his humble share to oppose them. What he had to say might not make an impression -might not do much or do any thing for his cause; still he was induced to address them, because he really could not reconcile it to his feelings to remain silent when considerations of such deep interest as the religion of the people were at hazard. The Ladies and Gentlemen now before him, with whom he had the misfortune to differ, were, no doubt, fully impressed with the idea of their own sincerity. He did not mean to call their sincerity in question; and as, on the one hand, he was willing to give them full credit for their motives, so, on the other, he hoped it was not too much that they would admit that he also was actuated by honest feelings-by an anxiety to defend the integrity of his religionto vindicate its sacred ministers, and to preserve the manliness, the morality, the natural affections and the best virtues of the Irish people.-He might be mistaken, but it was the firm conviction of his mind that that venerable religion, that those virtues and those affections would more or less suffer, if the Bible Society succeeded in their views. The Gentlemen at the other side, he was aware, were ready to contend that the virtues of the nation would be enlarged, and the morals and the feelings of the people improved by the success of their projects. Mr. Bric proceeded to argue at great length, and in a very eloquent strain, against the Biblical system of education. We regret our limits will not permit us to follow him. He then observed, that he was encouraged to go on by the attention with which he was heard; he regretted that he was likely, late as it was, to trespass for some time longer on their time. Indeed it was clear that they could not come to any satisfactory determination that evening; he would therefore suggest, before he went further, the propriety of an adjournment. This suggestion having met with the approbation of those about the Bench, Mr. Bric accordingly moved the question of adjournment to eleven o'clock the next morning, which was put and carried unanimously. The Chairman having left the chair, and the High Sheriff having been called thereto, Mr. O'Connell moved that the marked thanks of the meeting be returned to Mr. Freeman, which was carried unanimously. SECOND DAY, FRIDAY, SEPT. 10. The meeting was adjourned to eleven o'clock this morning, but long before that hour, the Court House was filled by Ladies and Gentlemen, who obtained access through the private entrances. When the public doors were thrown open, the rush was tremendous, and in a few minutes the Court House was crowded almost to suffocation. Immediately on taking the Chair, Mr. Freeman opened the business of the day by expressing his earnest desire that all present would observe the same decorum by which the proceedings of the day before had been marked. Mr. Bric resumed his argument of yesterday. He said that, in course of his observations on the former day, he had endeavoured to show that unity in religion was much to be desired, he had shewn that unity in matters of faith distinguished the Catholic religion; whilst in England, religion presented nothing but a mass of discordant opinions and fantastic and extravagant enthusiasm. Did the hon. Gentleman suppose, that if they succeed in their scheme of turning the hearts of the people of this country from the religion of their ancestors, that they would not almost instantly destroy unity in religion? To what state would they be reduced? Deprived of guides and of instruction; driven out of the harbour where their faith had been so long and so safely sheltered; they would be cast upon the wide and turbulent sea of their own imaginations; exposed to the rocks and shoals of infidelity, and to the dangerous tempest of their own unruly passions. It was really too bad, that gentlemen who might exert their philanthropy in useful and necessary objects, should waste their energies, in thus conducting a crusade against the religion of a nation; it was too bad, that Catholic parents will not be allowed to have their children instructed in matters of faith by the prelates and by the priests of their own religion, but that strangers ignorant of their faith, and for that reason avowedly hostile to it, should intrude upon them; if not to alarm at least to vex and annoy. There was the hon. Gentleman direct from England to instruct the deluded Irish. That did not surprise him, because he presumed from the gentleman's rank, that he had abundance of money to spend. And there was his gallant friend, who came over, it was to be hoped, for the same laudable purpose. He was not surprised to see the gallant officer, because a Scotchman, and Scotchmen were to be found every where. But, for the sake of the peace and the quiet of the country, he conjured gentlemen to desist from a fruitless and distressing task-distressing to others as well as to themselves. Let them attend in future to their own concerns, and leave the religious education of the poor children of Irish Catholics to the members of their own religion, for whom they felt so much veneration. They disturb the public mind; they may agitate the calm spirit of christianity; but, notwithstanding their title, their wealth and power, they never would succeed in their attacks upon the religion of the country. The public opinion was against them; the Catholic Clergy who had so strong a hold on the people, were decidedly against them. Why did they dare to interfere in the religious concerns of others? Would they tolerate so daring an intrusion on the part of the Catholics; would they endure the insulting mockery? He would implore them, in the language of the Scriptures, which they seem so anxious to propagate, to do unto others as they would wish to be done unto themselves. But they might say that they were actuated by good motives-by motives of charity and compassion towards the Irish poor; that the religious education of the Irish was neglected, and that it were better to have them instructed in some religion, than to leave them to grow up in total ignorance and darkness. Such an assertion might be made, but would be an assertion wide of the truth-it would be a calumnious assertion, reflecting directly on the Catholic clergy and laity of Ireland. It was the universal practice in this country to instruct every Catholic child in the catechism. Every child, male and female, is examined in the book, not only at school, but at public examinations, generally held in the Chapel. And what did the catechism contain? It contained 3 K the fundamental truths of the Christian religion; it put forth its purest precepts; it inculcated the best virtues, the love of God, and the love of our neighbours. It set out the ten commandments, and it called upon the children to observe those commandments as they regarded eternal happiness, or feared eternal misery. They are commanded by that book to love their neighbours as themselves, for the love of God, and then the question is asked, Who are our neighbours? The answer is-all mankind. Such was the nature of the Catholic catechism-such were the precepts it enforced. But it certainly went farther; it impressed on the minds of youth a due and solemn reverence for the religion of their ancestors, and, therefore it is not a book which the Bible Societies would wish to see in the hands of Catholic children. But was the catechism the only source of their religious instruction? By no means. The early and the constant practice of religious duty which the Catholic Church enforced-the necessity of prayer-the solemn office of confession-the awful sacrifice of the mass. Those sacred things, however they might excite the derision of ignorance and of bigotry, left upon the youthful mind the most salutary and the most lasting impression. Again, were the Catholics without schools--were they without books-were there no bibles -no religious tracts sent amongst them under the sanction of their clergy? They all recollected the strange charges which Mr. North was tempted to make in the House of Commons, on the question of education-charges of which he would say no more for the present than this, that they called forth from the clergy, in every part of Ireland, an indignant and satisfactory answer. From the returns made on that occasion, it appeared that the number of schools that had been formedthe number of children that had been instructed by the humble, unassisted, and calumniated Priests of Ireland, exceeded even what the warmest of their friends. supposed. They were instructed in the useful rudiments of education, and in the principles of religion and virtue; they were supplied with books best calculated to promote their improvement. With respect to the religious tracts, he knew that the clergy were most anxious to supply their schools with those tracts as far as their very limitted means admitted. It was a fact known to very few, that the Catholic bishop of Cork, a prelate in whose praise he would be silent, for it was not necessary to praise him where he was so well known-that learned and pious prelate had, through his single exertions, put to press no less than forty-five religious tracts. The fact seemed to excite surprise-it was heard in public for the first time, because the pious prelate did not think it desirable to sing his labours in the streets or publish them on the walls-no, he, and those with whom he laboured, the pure and blameless priesthood of Ireland, sought not for human praise; they do not go about the country to exhibit themselves to the public gaze, to debate on their own merits, or upon other's vices; they were contented in secresy and solitude to do the work of their heavenly Father, and were only forced into public when called to defend themselves against the attacks of rancorous bigotry. Now with respect to the reading of the Bible, he had, in the course of the discussion of yesterday, heard it confidently asserted that the Catholics opposed the reading of the Bible. Gentlemen were kind enough to take up much of their own and other's time, in order to show that the Bible was a sacred book; that it contained the great truths of Christianity, and that those truths ought to be known to all. Certainly it was an instance of amiable simplicity on the part of the gentlemen, who held forth for hours, in order to convince a Christian community that the Gospels of Christianity formed a proper book. What Christian ever expressed a doubt on the subject? What Catholic ever expressed a doubt of that sacred volume, which formed the foundation, he might say, the great charter of his religion? It was a calumny as gross and as wicked as ever came from the poisoned lips of bigotry, to say that the Catholic clergy were opposed to the study of the Scriptures; the contrary, was directly the fact-they read the book themselves-they constantly referred to it in their sermons and in their tracts-they recommended the peru. sal of it to the laity--they encouraged the publications of new editions; and at the instant he was addressing them, he believed that Mr. Coyne, of Dublin, had in the press a new and cheap edition of the Bible. The perusal of the Scriptures was encouraged by the priesthood; but it was not degraded into a task-book, it was not forced without note or comment on the young and the ignorant;-that book, the exact meaning of which, in many material passages, had for so many - ages filled all Christendom with disputes-that book upon which the most learned, the most pious, the most illustrious men, at both sides of the question, disagreed -that book was not deemed by the priesthood of Ireland, a fit and proper book to put into the hands of little boys and girls, whose intellect was as feeble and unformed as their bodies, for them to explain those doubtful points--for them to turn away from assistance and instruction, and to put upon the Scriptures their own interpretation. He could assure them that in this religious, he had almost said in this fanatical crusade, they would never succeed; but if they thought otherwise, he conjured them as good men to pause. Let them reflect upon the consequences of their triumph-their object was, for they avowed it, to turn the child against the religion of his parents-to teach the child to scoff and scorn at what his parents held in pious veneration. O! what a bitter change--what a pang of shame and misery must it carry to a parent's heart, to see the child of his affections, instead of kneeling with him at the altar of God, to see him turn away with scorn from that holy place, deriding his parent's piety, and mocking that Sacrament in which is contained the bread of eternal life. He spoke before sisters, he spoke before mothers, he spoke before sincere and pious protestants he would ask them, which of them would wish to see their children tainted by adverse doctrines, renegades and recreants from the religion of their fathers? There was not one among them, perhaps, who would not rather see that child, however dear to their hearts, torn away from them by the hand of death, than to see his mind perverted and his religious opinions destroyed. Did he blame them for that? Oh, no- they were sincere in their opinions-and to a sincere and religious heart no calamity could be so terrible. They seemed to agree with him in this-the softened countenances of those around him, bespoke in terms more eloquent than words, the feelings that worked within them; and now, he only asked of them to make the case of the poor Catholic parent their own-did they suppose that the poor Catholic was less sincere, less devoted to his religion than they were to their's. No, they did not. As he besought them, then, as they would spare a parent's feeling--as they would wish, in the language of God's commandment, that the child should honour his father and mother-he besought them by all the obligations of true religion-by all the pious charities of humanity- as mothers, as sisters, as good men, he implored them not to invade the peace of families, and under the semblance of religion, to wither and waste away the best, the purest, and the dearest of all human ties-the tie that bound a child to his parent. He had heard it said that education in Ireland had made but little progress. He certainly regretted that education had not made a greater progress amongst us-but it was not the fault of the Irish people. The want of education in Ireland might easily be traced to the state of law and government. It was not long since it was held a crime by the law of the landtheir Protestant ancestors made it a high crime in a Catholic to educate his child. That infamous act of parliament was repealed-but the moral effects of the laws survive the laws themselves. The Catholic has now permission to educate his child—but there is no encouragement-no government aid—the legislature has granted thousands to the Kildare-street Society, but not one farthing has been granted towards the education of the people. He had heard it said yesterday that there were but few religions in England-he believed there were more than two hundred; and he believed that those numerous and most fantastic religions were not the growth of piety or of knowledge, but of ignorance and presumption-he believed they were caused by the Scriptures having been put into the hands of weak and uninformed people. He held in his hand an English newspaper, in the columns of which," the most thinking people in the world" appeared absurd. The newspaper, which, by the way, was a High Church print, not inaptly described the thing as a specimen of cant and quackery: the advertisement commenced as usual with the name of a new religion, The Revivalist Community.' It stated that on Sunday, Aug. 18, 1824, a chapel in Spicer-street, Brick-lane, would be opened, when three sermons would be preached. That in the morning by Lucy Morgan, of Bury St. Edmond's, (loud laughter)-by the inspired Lucy Morgan, of Bury St. Edmonds; (continued laughter) that in the afternoon, by Mary Brown; (bursts of laughter) and that in the evening, by Mrs. Jones; (continued laughter.) beg pardon, it was not Mrs. Jones-the ladies have it not all to themselves, it was Mr. Jones, of Northampton, who in all probability was an old woman in his own way. (laughter.) Poor Mr. Jones of Northampton! how I feel for you! Two to one against Mr. Jones of Northampton. (a laugh) Lucy Morgan and Mary Brown, two damsels, I warrant you, who vindicate the privilege of the sex, two inspired young ladies, who could handle a sermon with far more dexterity, than they could handle scissars; there they are on one side, and Mr. Jones of Northampton, on the other, (much laughter,) fearful odds, alarming inversion of the order of things. Why we know that one woman at any time can talk down two men, but here is one unhappy man opposed two women-a species of martyrdom that certainly entitles him to the appellation of saint. Leaving this gentleman to repose on his bed of roses, I proceed to another notification: it is of a love feast. But I see the blush of modesty mantling the countenance of the ladies; and I will leave the feast of love to be described by others (applause.) We have, however, an account of a scene at a place of worship in the neighbourhood of Kensington Gravel-pits, which has nothing revolting about it, but certainly has something to amuse. It states the hour of worship-to be performed by a Mr. Waugh (a laugh)—and by other individuals, whose names are equally musical and romantic as the sentimental sound of Waugh (a laugh); and it adds, that for the convenience of the friends who might come from a distance, dinner would be provided, in the vestry, at two shillings each. —(A laugh.)—I really think that the vestry of a Church is rather an odd place to carry on the business of a tavern keeper.—(A laugh.) It is, however, pleasing to observe, that whilst those worthy persons attend to their spiritual wants, the substantial refection of the body is not altogether forgotten. For the gratification of the ladies, I should add, that good strong tea was also served up, price one shilling each. Those instances of fanaticism cannot be heard of without exciting merriment; but do they excite no other feeling? Do they give no cause of disgust and affliction? Do they convey no warning to those who are not lost in the vortex of fanaticism? Which of the ladies I now see around me would so far forget the delicacy of their sex? Which of them, forgetful of their sex, would mount a pulpit to rant and preach like those mountebank enthusiasts? How can the fathers of families look on such scenes without alarm?—and yet they have met here together to endeavour to effect that moral revolution, which in England, has made Lucy Morgan and Mary Brown become the preachers and the scandal of the Gospel. The spirit of fanaticism, if encouraged, may prove fatal, not only to the religion, but to the institutions of a people. I see on the bench some wealthy proprietors, and I assure them, that they will best secure their land by not interfering with the religion of the people. The Catholic religion, unlike the religion of those who brought King Charles to the block, is a religion favourable to Government and established institutions. Men of property would do well not to seek its subversion-but the hon. gentleman (Mr. Noel), whose mind is directed to matters of higher consideration, not only anticipated the fall of that religion-but he has expressed his deep conviction that the people of Ireland never could enjoy that light of Heaven, because they adhered to their religion-I repeat, in the presence of the honourable gentleman, that he made use of these memorable words, and he certainly has the manliness not to go back from what he said. I will not say that the observations of the honourable gentleman proceeded from a bad spirit-from a heart full of rancour and bigotry; but this I will say, that the honourable gentleman has paid, in this instance, but little regard to the propriety of language-he has betrayed gross ignorance of the religion which he has defamed, when he has blasphemously declared, that the light of eternal salvation could never shine upon its followers. Is it possible after that observation, and after the avowal that has been made of your object, that the people of this country will ever allow any interference of your's in the religious education of their children. You have removed the mask; from this day forward we will look upon you as enemies to our faith, and we will exert every effort to defeat your objects-to preserve from your artifice and from your violence the religion of our forefathers-a religion which has been consecrated by the sufferings of its adherents, which has not been impaired by the persecution of its foes, and which is likely to preserve the kindly and glorious influence of its sway long after the folly and the bigotry of the present hour shall be forgotten. Mr. O'Connell said he did know whether he should be pardoned for addres |
