forts of persons, for all sorts of crimes; commit. consider their situations as enviable compare with ted against all sorts of persons. He then confi. the rest of Europe ; had caught them to feel dered the precedents which had been adduced to that if they enjoyed the promising growth of juftify the present bill, and shewed they did not spring, they enjoyed all the fullness of harvest; apply to this case:- the first of these, that which that their situation was hourly and rapidly impaffed in the year after the revolution, was rather proving ; that they were less oppressed with a consequence of the revolution than an exception taxes than any other peasantry in Europe; that to its principles, was of the same kind as that their poison was lately taxed, and their wholewhich had passed in the reign of Henry the VII. fome luxury untaxed, and that not a man in the to exculpate those who had supported the king community suffered injury and oppression, save de jure against the king de facto. To the gen- those gentlemen whole property they had plun. tlemen who urged this act as a precedent he dered, or whose lives they had destroyed, and would recommend it when they talked of the re- that there was no country on carth where come volution, to remember what led to that revolu- forts were lo general and distrels ro partial, and tion—a ftruggle for the dispensing power in the that the true source of their wahappiness, is solely erown! As little did the precedents drawn from owing to the delusive prevalence of the French the years 1715, and 1745 apply for those were principles ani the cant of equality ; they would times when open rebellion was to be opposed by be foon taught to feel their real grievances were other measures than the due course of law, and trivial indeed, however numeroas their imagicould not be compared with a time of partial and nary ones. doubtful insurrection. It was natural to expect, Mr. Fitzgerald (knight of Kerry) in a very he said, that when the necessity for this meafure able speech-lamented that any difference in was less strong, the measure itself would have opinion should arise on the present occasion, been more moderate the contrary was the cafe left it might be construed into any thing of hefi. --for the acts of indemnity on chole former oc- tation to support the government in putting down casions went only to the arresting of suspected fedition. He should always preter the pasting of persons, the breaking open of houses, and the acts of indemnity for tranigression of the law, in pressing of horles--the present act went to cover support of the state and contitution, than inthe actual transportation of men from their na creating the penal code. tive country without form law, or shadow of Mr. Brook thought that nothing but a tempetriat! Nay it went farther-it covered not only rate and firm government could save this country the transportation of men without trial, but the in the present crifis; he thought the present actual taking of men without trial out of the government to be good and therefore should king's prisons, where they were out of the pos. give it his support; he voted for the order of fibility of being dangerous, and with relpect to the day. whom, therefore the plea of expediency did not Mr. Weftby was convinced of the necessity of hold.-The bill, it was said, would only indem- the bill. He thought the notoriety of the facts nify those whose motives lhould by a jury be justified this bill, too ftrong to require further found laudable>true, bur it did not make the proofs. He declared that while he should alsteceffity of the illegal act a subject for the jury, ways be proud in evincing his good wishes and and yet in the court of K. B. which generally friendship to the lower orders of the people, so Icaned lightly on its officers, gross ignorance was long as they maintained obedience and respect to confidered as good a caule for attachment as the laws, so he should be the first to maintain crime or corruption. It would be well if the those law's against seditious or refractory conduct bill attended to this principio for it was no time on their parts. to give examples of violating the laws. The Mr. Wynne supported the motion of the attorhouse should at least on this evening look cauti. ney general. He expressed his tribute of gratiously at the conduct of magistrates yiolating the rude for the exertions of lord Carhampton, which, Jaw against the poor, when, by the bill of to- from residing within a short distance of the noble morrow evening the poor would in some fort be lord, he had an opportunity of witnessing day and put out of the protection of the law.

night, and which he declared to be che salvation Sir H. Langrijke drew an elegant and affecting of this country: piQưre of the deluded miscreancy of the lower The Chancellor of the Exchequer said, that orders of the people in several parts of this king. whatever might be the fate of the righe hon. dum, and though doctors had differed as to the gentleman's motion, he congratulated him upon caule and cure, he would beg leave as one of the the result, and the body of information it bad humbleft of the college to say a few words, brought forward and he congratulated the house

The exaggerated pictures of popular diftress upon the acquisition of luch facts as placed the drawn of late in that house, were lo overloaded neceffity of the bill beyond the possibility of with drapery, by the fanciful hand of the artist, doubt. as totally to spoil the likeness and proportion Mr. Egan faid, that though he came down to of the original. But if gentlemen instead of teach- the house determined to oppose the bill, and to ing the lower orders of the people of Ireland to fupport the motion of his right hon. friend, as consider their fituation as the most miserable and soon as he heard it-yet when he heard so many degrading of the human race, and thus encoue respectable gentlemen on all sides of the house, raging to justify their crimes by the parliamentary rise in their places, and declare upon their hodescription of their distrelles, had caught them to nours, the facts respecting the situation of their



respective counties, he should not feel himself of their having removed the witnesses who might an honest man if he did not support the right hon. prosecute them, he would think it justifiable, gentleman's motion.

perhaps, so to dispose of them ; but what reason Şir L. Parsons thought nothing could be more could there be for taking away a man already mischievous than to make the present a question safely lodged in prison, and waiting the decifion of party, but he was for inquiry into the partie of the law ? He would be glad to hear the truth cular conduct of magistrates, in order to see how or falsehood of the reports from the judges, and far they were juftified by neceflity, before the they would be able to give the desired informa. house should pass a bill to indemnify them. tion from che calendar of prisoners which must

Sir W. Gleadowe gave his warmeft fupport to be returned to them at the aflizes, and from their the bill. He declared he had been witness to being necessarily acquainted with the manner in the impressing of many persons charged with de- which each of these were disposed of. If any fenderism into his majesty's service, and he never prisoner should be found to have been so removed heard of a single one of them alluded to, who was as he had stated, would the mover of the bill in. not proper objects of the procedure.

demnify the magistrate who thould have fo acted ? Mr. Rochfort was furprised to find any oppofi. But there was another report, that certain mie tion to the bill but was sure it would not be op giftrates had privately conferred together, and posed by any gentleman who really knew the without any information on oath, or good evistate of the country. He did not wish to violate dence of any kind, did, at heir own pleasure, the feelings of the house by a detail of the hor. and without observing any form of law whatever, sors committed in the county where he relided ; lay hands on several of their useful and laborious Come instances however deserved mention. In fellow subjects, and transport them! Would many cases the miscreants filing themselves de- any man justify this conduct ? [A cry of yes fenders attacked people's houses in the dead hour from a member.] I am sorry said Mr. Ponsonby, of the night, tied ropes round their necks to force that there is one such man in the house; but I out their tongues, which they cut off to prevent am sure this hon, gentleman stands alone in this their informing and in some instances where per sentiment. [A cry of no! no!) I lament it fons had been induced to prosecute these mis. then extremely, said he, that there should be a creants, and afterwards fled the county for fear, number of men in this allembly, who, from they were followed to the counties where they pamion or any cause, hould so forally forget the bad taken refuge, dragged out of their beds at first princ ples of justice. How would gentlemen night, found tied fix together, on a dung hill, like to be themselves in this situation, obnoxious and fired at like marks, till shot to death. to the malice or pique of every enemy, and lia

With respect to the conduct of the magiftrates, ble, at the capricious will of a neighbour, to be in sending men on board his majesty's ships, he transported for life? Let gentlemen confider this utterly denied the facts to have been as stated subject seriouny ; the time may not be far dif. no man was sent away from the county in which tant, when the rule which is now applied to the he lived, who was not sworn against as a defender, poor man with impunity, may be applied to those and deemed guilty by the committee of magis- who move in a much higher sphere. trates (worn to do justice, or who did not after. Mr. Curran Itrongly supporied the motion for wards confess his guilt, and went without reluc, the inquiry. Some exceffes he believed bad tance, thankful for his life being saved.

taken place which no friend to his country could Mr. G. Ponsonby thought it right to go into fee without the deepest concern. But it was not the inquiry, because no gentleman had yet given from hearsay that the belief of a general confedethe necessary information to the house. For racy against the Itate fhould be adopted-it should what had gentlemen related ? the disturbances not be a belief founded on a mere hatred of the which had existed in the country, and the barba- lower orders. Of bills of indemnity he admitted rity of some crimes which had been committed. the principle, that was the breach of the law for He was sorry to find by these accounts, that note the safety of the state. Was it so in the last year? withftanding all the strong measures which those that was the purpose of the inquiry. It was to magistrates had taken, the country was rather in see if such necesity existed, whether such breach, a worfe ftate than it had been ; for was not the and to such a degree was necessary. He knew murder of Mr. Harman the most atrocious crime from public evidence on oath that most flagrant which had been committed, and yet he had been opprefion had been practiced upon some poor murdered since those illegalities of the magiftrates people by magistrates ; taken from their beds, at had taken place. He thought those illegalities midnight, and transported no man knew whither, should be inquired into before the house palled an without the colour of accusation, or form of indemnity for them. Some of these illegal acts trial. No such acts were done in England at any appeared of a very unwarrantab'e kind indeed., of the times alluded to, nor does any act of ina In some counties, it was said, he knew not with demnity there extend to any arbitrary fentence of what truth, that men who were in his majesty's execution of any man, or any thing not inevitajails, legally committed, had, a little time be- ble at times of convulsion. Nothing was done to fore the affizes, been taken away from the cus- separate the rich from the poor, and to make tody of the law, without any trial, without any wealth a proof of innocence, and poverty itself a accusation or legal form, without even the form crime. He wilhed to have the report of the of a sentence, and sent on board his majesty's judges on the stare of the country, and the geneThips. Had these men been in the act of disturb. Tal conduct of the magiitrates. They must have in the peace, or on evidence of their guilt and observed coolly; they had the best means of ob

serving i

ferving they could not be mined by the malig.. that when magistrates profeffing the public nity of panic

. He appealed to the candour of safety as their object violaced the law, the pregen lemen themselves, whether they did not feel fumption should be in favour of the magistrates ; fome warmth on this subje&t ? and whether men but presumption alone should not be sufficient for who had the power of judging in their own ears the house to act on; something more thould be ought also to pronounce on their own evidence looked for. As to what had been said to this fub. against those who could not speak for themselves ? ject by the country gentlemen he should only observe As to himself he abhorred outrages as much as that were he a country gentleman he should have any man; he wihi no for delay, but he voted for the inquiry, however full his own in. wishes for information, for temper, and there. formation might be ; because not to do fo would fore for inquiry.

be so vote an indemnity to himself, being in the Mr. Prime Serjeant wished to çall the recol. magistracy, without suffering the public to know lection of gertlemen to the principle of the bill, whether he was guilty or innocent. Befides in wbich by no means went to indemnify any man the subject of the disturbances the passions of : upun any other principle but cha: of trial by jury. gentlemen were engaged, and they were not As the law now food, courts of justice were wise counsellors to take in legislation. bound to maintain them inviolate ; and juries With respect to the inability of the judges to were bound by their oaths, however reluctant give satisfactory information, he would ask were their feelings, to support those laws : but the they not intelligent observers of facts, and of the present bill went to enlarge the power of courts conduct of the magistrates ? Must not governand juries, and leave them a discretion in favour ment have consulted them before they brought of men who had acted with pure motives for the forward this measure ? and if they could give la. public good.

tisfactory information to government, why not to Mr. Hardy said he had always felt a pride in the house? If, however, notwithítanding these voting with his hon. friend (Ms. Grattan), but realons, the house should think proper to reject he coul of on the present occasion ; but must the inquiry, he must acquiefce; he still, how. uneg. ivocally fupport the principle of the bill, ever, retained a full conviction of its neceffity. and agreed to the neceflity of adopting it without The question on the order of the day being put, delay. Would gentlemen refleci on the confe. it passed without a division. quence that might result from delay. Would The indemnity bill was then read a second time they louk to the character and tyranny of Robe- and committed for to-morrow. spierre? There were in this country hundreds of Feb. 4.] The Attorney General moved the men anxious to pluck the diadem from the tem- order of the day. ples of royally, in order to invest themselves The house, according to order, resolved itself with something like the tway of Robespierre. into a committee of the whole house, to take

Lord Maxwell lamented that fince exertion on into consideration “ the bill for indemnifying the part of the gentlemen of the country in put. such persons as have acted fince the first day of ting down defenderism ceased, that sanguinary fpi- January, 1795, for the preservation of the pub. rit was become now almost as bad as ever. No. lic peace, and suppression of the insurrections thing was heard of there but conspiracy, bur. prevailing in some parts of this kingdom," Mr. glary, plunder, and massacre.

Burgh in the chair. Mr. Gratian now replied to the several gentle Alter some progress had been made, men who ipoke against his motion. However Mr. M. Beresford, with a view of sending a he honoured the suggestions of country gentle message to the bords moved, that the chairman do men, he thought that something more than sug- report progress and ask leave to fit again in a quare gestions were necefiary in making laws such as ter of an hour, which was agreed to ; and on the that before the house. He was the more con- house being resumed, firmed in this, because in England inquiry ale Mr. Burgh reported progress, and got leave to ways precejed acts of this nature, and he menti- fit again in a quarter of an hour. oned as an initance the committee which had Sir John Tydd brought up the report from the been appointed to inquire into the necessity of select committee appointed to inquire into the suspending the habeas corpus act on a late occa- bigh price of corn, which is as follows: “ Rem fion. He was confirmed in his opinion that in- folved, that it is expedient to prevent the exporquiry should be diad, because notwithstanding the tation of corn, malt, four, biscuit, bread, and trong measures of the magistracy, the country potatoes from this kingdom for a limited time." yet remained in a itate of lupprefied insurrection. The report was agreed to by the house. The motion he was convinced was therefore pro Mr. Sec. Pelham moved, that an humble ad per, and it would not be wise in the house if they dress be presented to his excellency the lord lieureje&ted the present inquiry to look into the fate tenant, praying, that pursuant to the said reloa of the country before the expiration of the fes- lution, bis excellency will take fuch measures Gon.

as he hall think expedient ; which was agreed Delay could not be objected to the motion, for to. the inquiry proposed might be bad in 24 hours ; Ordered, that Mr. Pelham and the Chancellor and as to the argument that the information of the exchequer do carry up the said resolution fought was unnecessary, he must say that how to the lords, and defire their concurrence thereto. ever unnecessary it might be to those gentlemen Went again into committee on the indemnity who were conversant in the convulsed counties, bill. to others it was not ynaccesary. He granted After a conversation between the Attorney


General, the Prime Serjeant, sir L. Parsons, Mr. fund must be provided for that purpose. The Lgan, Mr. Stuart, Mr. Curran, fir.J. Blaquiere, expence of forage, owing to the rise on hay and and Mr. Hoare, the bill was gone through with corn, would be increased from 59,000l. te fome amendments, and a clause was introduced, 74,000l. at the suggestion of Mr. Egan, that any person The next head for increased expence of the who might think himself aggrieved by being sent royal hospital of Kilmainham £21,977 out of the kingdom by a magiftrate, and if he But this in reality, was not an increase in fact fhould be absent for three years, might within fix upon the general expenditure ; it was in lieu of months after his return be at liberty to bring his the sum heretofore paid by soldiers to the support a&tion, .provided he could fhew that from dif- of that hospital, but which was afterwards repais tance, fickness, or other inevitable neceility, he to them in another way; but the military now could not return to this kingdom sooner. by another arrangement received their full pay;

On the house being resumed, ordered, that the which while it was the very same thing to the report be received to-rnorrow.

expence of the country, was much more satisface A message from the lords, by two of the mar. tory to the soldier who heretofore imagined, beters in chancery, that the lords had agreed to the cause his daily advance was less thran his nominal resolution sent up by this house.

pay, that he was unfairly dealt by. Read a second time, “ the bill for the more The saving, on the expences under the head offeâually preventing insurrections, tumults and of ordnance in this eftimate, compared with the riots, by persons ftiling themselves defenders, preceding year would be 26,1711. This owing and other disorderly persons.”

to a store of musquetry and powder being pure After a laort conversacion, between fir L. Par. chased in the present year. fons and Mr. Egan, who ftated, that some parts Having rated those particulars as the only of the bill were exceptionable, and the Attorney ones that seemed to him material ; he referred General, who faid, that in order to give gentle gentlemen who wilh to be more minutely in men a full opportunity to consider the bill, he formed to the ettimates on the table ; from which should move that the bill be committed for Wed, it appeared that the expences of the present year mesday next. Moved accordingly, and the bill were

2.1,996,323 ftands committed for that day.

And the eftimate for the future 1,989,399 5.) The house resolved into a committee of Or a decrease of

7,424 fupply.

He had also brought into the estimate the arThe right hon. Mr. Mason in the chair. rears due on the 25th of March, 1795, of 97,8911.

The Chancellor of the Ex hequer proceeded to in order that there might be legal authority for fate the eftimates for the public expences of the the payment thereof. But an instance of this ensuing year.

kind, must occur every year, for it does not beThe three firft eftimates included the expences come due until the quarter expires; for instance of the army, the total of which was 637,2921. many of those expences under the head of baros. 9d. which made a decrease from the expences racks and ordnance are due in the course of the of the present year on this head of 4,4421. year, and not paid.

In the current year Ireland furnished to the In addition to the expences he had stated, there army abroad but 19,095 men; but in the next were other claims on the treasury, created by laws year the would have to furnish her full number, which had paffed in that house ; for initance wrecably to the compact formed in the admi- those for informaries and police. But the prin. niftration of lord Townshend, viz. 3235 - and in cipal head, under which the increase of expendi. time of war it was but fair we should furnith our ture would appear moft extraordinary, was the full quota; so that in the augmentation of the conveyance of military baggage from one part of amy at home there was a decreale, on comparing the country to another. Formerly the price althe expences of the current and the estimate of lowed to the carriers was but three pence per the future year, of

£0.27,953 mile, but in the last seffion of parliament, the And in the difference of pay to our

rate was, perhaps improvidently increased to 7d. army abroad next year, an increased

per mile. Any regulation neceffars on this head expence of

17,848 inight be settled by the house, when the mutiny And the decrease made on the three

bill came before them. The expeace in the heads was

8,842 former year was 35,000l. but he would not now The next head was also for military purposes, ftate it less than 75,000). This would make the amount of which was

6.437,414 total charges for the year 2,171,3231. which is 75,00ol. more than last year. These He then recapitulated the estimates, extraore comprehend the whole of the military charges, dinaries exclusive of the civil lift, and pensions as excepting militia. In this increase there was the amounting to

21,996,333 fum of 5,7671. for additional staff officers to Parliamentary payments,

75,000 manage an increased army, which would of course Arrears,

100,000 be reduced at the reduction of the army itself.There was also an allowance of 30,000l. for the


52,191,323 seeruiting service. The reason of this is, that the recruiting service of the current year was Towards which cxpence he stated principally carried on by the file of commillions ; there would be a fund remaining but as “it would not be expedient to go on in

unapplied of

463,894 qealing the number of the regiments, some other


Revenue, after providing for civil

from thence ready made. This would produce lift and pensions,

962,704 3000). Bonus an lottery,

65,000 He would produce a regulation as to franking, Repayments,

6,080 which would produce 200cl.

Some regulations and additions on the tax of

£1,497,678 hair powder would be adopted. To be provided by loan,

673,645 The next was an assimilation of the stamp du.

ties on bills, notes, and receipts in Ireland, to £2,171,323 the principle adopted in England, by extending

the duty to bills and receipts so low as for sums of The Chancellor of the Exchequer here congra- 478. this he supposed would produce 5000l. tulated the committee on the state of the coun. There was another principle on which he could try, and the conduct which had been shewn in not calculate, it was a tax on fucceffions fimilar the management of its revenues, whereby go. to chat lately adopted in England ; and he should vernment were enabled to bring forward a saving first wait to see the English bill before he brought of 463,8941. and only to ask a loan for the ex. forward any regulation on this head. pences of the year of 674,000l. ; whereas in the There was another ground on which it was Taft year government was obliged to ask a loan of necesTéry something should be done in order to 1,341,666. He hoped that a diminution of de-' fatisfy the public mind. It was on the subject of mand, amounting to 599,586. would be felt in the gold found in the county of Wicklow; it is due light by the public, and that credit would was necessary to satisfy the public mind, whether be given to the prosperity of the country, and the this matter was really of so much importance as @nduct of government, by which the same ex generally represented or not. The intention of crtions could be supported with so great a dimi- gavernment was that some experiments should be nution of demand ; and he shewed how much made there at an expence of about sool, in oron the one hand was to be attributed to the in- der to cry how far the discovery was valuable. it creased revenues of the country ; and on the was understood that all such mines were of royal other, to the integrity of administration, which property ; if so, and that this appeared of any was industrious to bring every possible saving to importance it should be turned to national advanthe credit of the public.

tage, and an ait palied for that purpose : but in The Chancellor of the Exchequer then stated this, care should be taken to secure private prothe sums necessary to be borrowed, for replacing perty so far as justice required. measury bills due, which exceeded 500,000l. ; There was another ground of claim on the pube but on this subject he no further descanted than lic account; it was on the governors of the to say, that in replacing those sums, fome addi. bank of Ireland, whose charter expired. On acwional interest would accrue in proportion to the count of their inftitution new officers and other present state of the market. After having thus arrangements had been created, at very considera. mentioned the general extent of his demands, ex- ble expence to government, which he thought clusive of some items, which he reserved for a they ought to pay before the charter was to be future day, he went on briefy to mention the renewed. objects on which he meant to propose additional There were some other claims upon the trea taxation; and in this he should comply as well fury, which it would be necessary to provide, if with the recommendation in the speech of his the house should think fit. One was a charge of excellency the lord lieutenant from the throne, 1100l, a year for the support of decayed military as with the wishes of gentlemen on the other fide gentlemen, heretofore paid under the head of of the house, in taking care to lay no burthens to military contingencies, and which, if withdrawn affect the poor.

A tax on wines seemed little from them, they must be left to ftarve. likely to affect them and therefore he proposed He also suggested, that it would be necessary to * to lay a tax of 61. per ton on Portugal wines- increase the number of the treasury board. There and according to the condition of the Methuen were but four members who could fit, and three treaty, a tax of a third more, or gl. per ton, on were necessary to make a quorum. He, himself, French wines. This, reckoning on our ordinary had hitherto always attended, but public duty imports, would make 37,0 ol..but as there would necessarily require his absence in England, was an extraordinary importation of wine in the and the board, being a check on public expendio present year, it could not be expected it would ture, its operations could not be long suspended be so much in the ensuing year, and therefore he consistently with the intereft of the public. would reckon it but 30,000l.

There was another branch of expence for the The next was a duty of three halfpence per consideration of the house, and it would be discreo buskel, on white fale imported into this kinga tionary to adopt or rejea it. The rank of colonel som; but this though it would produce fome. had been given to the lieutenant-colonels of mi. thing considerable was only a regulating duty, litia, and those gentlemen were taught to expect and calculated to benefit the falt manufacture of the pay also. This, therefore, was for the boure Ireland, as in England a duty of one penny per to direct. Having now gone through his itate. * buihel was laid on the exportation of rock salt, ment, he would anticipate a question which had

which while it enhanced che raw material to this frequently been asked in the course of debate, country, secured the manufacture of white falt 'what retrenchments were “intended to be made ?" 10 England, and obliged us to import our fale To this he would answer, thar the civil list had


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