cations to the Houfe, and to affure his Majefty that their Lordships would take the most effectual means to carry into execution fuch measures as might tend to the fecurity of public credit.” The Duke of Grafton had not any objection to the Addrefs; but he wifhed to know whether it was the intention of Minifters to pass any act compulsory on the public, to make them accept notes inftead of cash for the payment of debts. His Grace condemned the prefent measure, fo far as it went to be compuliory on the Bank to accede to what the Privy Council had advanced. Lord Grenville faid, in relpect to what fell from the Noble Duke refpect ing a compulfory Act to make people take Bank-notes, no fuch matter was in agitation. He was not at prefe at prepared to ftate what might be the effect of a Regulation Bill.1 his matter more properly belonged to the other Houfe; and when what they had determined upon came before their Lordships, he fhould then deliver his sentiments upon the fubject. Lord Guildford, Lord Albemarle, and the Duke of Norfolk faid a few words on the fubject, and then the Mation being put, it was carried nem. diffent.

Lord Grenville then read another Motion, which was, "That aSecret Committee of Nine fhould be appointed to enquire into the Finances of the Bank, and to make their Report to the Houfe.

The Duke of Bedford moved an Amendment, "That the Committee fhould be an open, and not a fecret one." Lords Grenville, Liverpool, Auckland, Fauconberg, and Albemarle, fupported the original Motion against the Amendment, which latter was fupported by the Dukes of Grafton and Norfolk, and

The Marquis of Lanfdown, who observed, that much had been said of the unfounded and exaggerated alarms which had plunged us into our prefent unfortunate fituation. It was ridiculous to talk of the general credit of the Country being hurt by alarms. would trace it to its true fource. Had

HOUSE

MONDAY, FEB. 20. CORPORATE JURISDICTIONS.

He

the continuance of a War which had drained the Nation of an immenfe quantity of fpecie nothing to do with the calamity? The profufion of Government in the creation of new offices, increase of falaries, the annual deficiencies in almost every department of the public Revenue, instead of expected furpluffes, would, perhaps, better account for the public diftrefs than the alarm of invafion. Every public office was in arrear, even to the fmalleft fums; and fo ignorant was the Minister of the demands for the general expenditure of the Nation, that he had not been able to calculate within TEN MILLIONS of the fum wanted fo late as the 23d of December laft! The first Lord of the Treafury was no longer Prime Minister of this Country. Every man in office had his hand in the public purfe. There was no controul till the money was actually expended, or, what was the fame thing, the debt incurred. To this, no doubt, was owing the enormous iffue of paper, and confequently the heavy difcounts that naturally followed it. The fame thing would take place in the manufacture of Bank paper. Every man who had money would fell it, and we should have two prices for. the fame commodity. He did not like the idea of force to compel perfons to receive any paper, however well fecured; and he was convinced it would be attended with the most fatal effects. He hoped, however, that Minifters, before it was too late, would now begin to think of the neceffity of economy in the public expenditure.

The Lord Chancellor replied fhortly, and fupported the arguments of Lord Grenville. He declined faying any thing as to the effect of making Bank Notes a legal tender, or of forcing individuals to receive them in payments, as that question was not before the Houfe.

The Houfe divided on the Amendment propofed by the Duke of Bedford, Content

'Not Content

Adjourned.

O, F

ON the fecond reading of this Bill, Mr. P. Coke fhortly recapitulated its purport to fuch Members as might nct have been present at the time of its

12

78

Majority 66

the Jury came to the trials with minds prejudiced and predetermined. In Southampton, Poole, and other large places, the utmost inconvenience was experienced from this circumstance. But the evil did not reft here for affizes were never held in thefe places but at the request of the Corporation, which, to avoid the expence, feldom made fuch request until the gaols were crouded. It frequently happened, that feveral years thus elapfed without criminals being brought to trial; and he inftanced one cafe of a murderer who was not tried till after the expiration of feven years, when death had carried off all the witneffes against him. His object was to give plaintiffs, profecutors, and defendants an option of being tried in the Court of the County at large, or that of the Corporation. He intended, he faid, to have the Bill referred to a Select Commit-ee above ftairs, and afterwards recommitted for difcullion in the whole House.

Mr. Wigley and Mr. Jeffery made an obfervation or two each, after which the Bill was read a fecond time, and referred to a Committee above ftairs for

to-morrow.

DOWNTON ELECTION PETITION. Mr. Tyrwhitt brought up, as Chairman of the Committee appointed to try the merits of the Downton Election, the Report of the faid Committee. It determined that the fitting Member was duly elected, but that the Petition against him was neither frivolous nor vexatious.

SOUTHWARK ELECTION. Mr. H. Thornton faid, he had a Petition to prefent from 1,150 Electors of Southwark, complaining of their having been deprived of the opportunity of voting, as they had no notice that Mr. Thelluffon was ineligible. They could not expect that the Houfe would reverfe their late determination; but they trufted that in future fome alteration would be made in the exifting law, and that the abufes would be corrected. The Petition was brought up, and ordered to lie on the table.

Mr. Tierney hoped the Hon. Member would follow the Petition by a fpecific Motion, to take it into confideration. His fituation was very unpleafant, as that Petition charged him with having affumed the character of a Reprefentative, The Hon. Member faid the Petition fpoke the fenfe of the majority of the Electors; in that he

differed from him: the believed the majority would difclaim that Petition, which had been obtained by circular letters fent to thofe who were inimical to him, while his friends were ignorant that fuch a Petition was proposed. However general the prayer of the Petition might be, it was ufual for the Member prefenting it to make fome specific Motion. He was certain the Houfe would attend to any that the Hon. Gentieman fhould make, and he anxiously waited until fuch Motion fhould afcertain his fituation in that House.

Mr. H. Thornton faid, he had done what he thought his duty, in opening the general heads of the Petition; but he did not fee how he could make the Motion required by the Honourable. Gentleman.

Mr. Tierney replied, that the Pe tition now upon the Table accufed him of getting his feat unconftitutionally; and if nothing more was done in it, the charge remained against him. He wifhed it to be enquired into; but, if no Motion was made, he thought it wou'd be proper for him to complain that, under colour of a Petition, a Member had been infulted.

FRIDAY, FEB 24.

FOREIGN GRAIN,

Mr. Alderman Lushington, in pur. fuance of notice, rofe to fubmit the grounds of his Motion" for the ap pointment of a Committee to inquire into the caufes and extent of the foffes fuftained by British Merchants in fupplying the Country with Foreign Grain, after Government had defifted from attempting it." It might be urged, that it was incompatible with a general principle to indemnify Merchants for unfuccefsful fpeculations; but he thought the peculiarity of the circumstances attending this cale would take it out of that general principle. All the corn that had been furnished by Government in 1795, including captures, did not exceed 2,5co quarters, when the quantity furnished, by the Merchants the following year ex ceeded 700,000 quarters. This vaft influx of grain, fortunately for the Country, but unfortunately for the adventurers, reduced the market price fo much, as to occafion a lofs of 60 or na per cent.

He concluded by moving, "That a Committee fhould be appointed to inveftigate the causes and extent of the

loffer

loffes fuftained by the merchants importing corn in the year 1796, after Government had ceafed to purchase on its own account." The Motion was agreed to.

QUAKERS' RELIEF BILL.

The Order of the Day for the Houfe refolving itself into a Committee of the whole Houfe, on a Bill for granting Relief to the people called Quakers, and for taking their folemn affirmation in criminal as well as civil cafes, being read; and the queftion being put, that the Speaker now leave the Chair,

Sir W. Scott ftared at confiderable length his objections to the farther progrefs of the Bill. They pointed chiefly to that branch of the Bill which refpected the payment of tithes. He profeffed himself to be no enemy to toleration, but by toleration he meant that kind of toleration, which, as it affected religious opinions, was hot in confiftent with the civil rights of property. It was not enough that religious opinions fhould be fincere, in order to give them a claim to protection, for if they injured the civil rights of others, they could have no fuch pretenfions. It was erroneous to fuppofe that tithes were a fpecies of property merely ecclefiaftical; in many cafes they were lay property. A large proportion of tithe property was in lay hands under the title of lay appropriations. But the Quakers refufed to pay tithes to the appropriator, as well as to the clergyman, though the property had been in his poffetiion for more than three hundred years, a period much longer than the perfuafion upon which they acted had been in existence.

Mr. Serjeant Adair faid, with regard to the principle of his Learned Friend, on which he founded his objection to the measure, that no refpect ought to be hewn to religious fcruples where they went to affect property, he could not agree with him to the extent in which it had been stated, He thought that fome refpect ought to be fhewn even to thofe religions which might be confidered as abfurd, though they in volved this confequence, and they might even be the object of that good-natured toleration which his Learned Friend had mentioned. His Learned Friend faid, that to fuch fcruples the Legiflature ought not at all to yield. He admitted that the Legislature ought not fo far to yield to them as to leffen the

fecurity of property; but yet he thought it wife, juft, and humane, to give fuch indulgence as was confiftent with its moft perfect fecurity. Alterations in the laws which tended to afford ease to the perfon who entertained the fcruple, without injuring the property which it regarded, he would contend, were wife, juft, and humane; and till his Learned Friend could fhew that the prefent Bill would actually produce the effect which he deprecated, he would not consent to the application of his principle.

The Solicitor General faid, that the whole argument of the Learned Serjeant proceeded upon the idea, that thẹ body of Quakers laboured under a confiderable grievance. Now he denied that any fuch grievance exifted, or that any Quakers were liable to be treated with the feverities which had been alledged, on the score of their religious fcruples. For a period of twenty years no perfon of that perfuafion had been imprifoned for confcience fake. The great body of refpectable Quakers were actuated by no fcruple with respect to the payment of tithes, nor did they with for the interference of the law on the fubject. There were refpectable Quakers who were tithe-owners and tithe-renters, and it was abfurd to fuppole that they could feel any con fcientious fcruple in paying to others what they themselves received and collected,

in

The Houfe divided, For the Question Against it

33

33

The Speaker gave the cafting vore favour of the Ayes.

CAPTAIN MANNING'S CASE. Mr. Alderman Combe prefented a Petition from Edward Manning, Efq. Commander of one of the Eaft India Company's fhips, which, he obferved, contained a cafe of extraordinary hardship. The Petitioner was the holder of a promiffory note for 2,500l. indorfed to him for a valuable confideration, the payment of which was refifted folely from its having been drawn upon an agreement ftamp. He therefore folicited for a Bill to enable the Commif fioners of Stamps to put the proper ftamp upon the note.

The Solicitor General, after obferving that it was impoffible Captain Manning fhould have intended the fmalleft fraud on the revenue, which would have only required one filling

more

more, faid, that fuch a Bill was neverthelefs not to be granted without confiderable attention from the Houfe.

The Petition was then brought up, and ordered to lie on the Table; and the Houle adjourned.

MONDAY, FEB. 27.

LANDING OF THE FRENCH IN WALES. A Member rofe to call the attention of the Houfe to the late attempt of the French upon Wales. He faid, that he faw fomething exceedingly portentous in the manner in which the Enemy had effected a defcent upon the coaft of Wales with 1,400 men with arms, but without tents or field pieces. It was a matter very extraordinary, that fuch a number of men fhould land, form themfelves into a body upon a hill; and, without fhewing any difpofition to oppofe the people, or the force that had marched against them, furrender them felves at difcretion. Fourteen hundred men, with arms in their hands, could unquestionably have done fomething; but from their conduct, it appeared clear to him that they had been landed for no other purpofe than that of being made prifoners. Under this confideration, he could not help founding an alarm to the country; and, as he did not know how to act upon the occafion,, he begged to be informed what measure was molt proper to be adopted upon the occafion, and what Motion it would be right for him to propofe to the House.

The Speaker informed him, that it remained for him to propofe fome Motion to the Houfe, in the form of an Addrefs to his Majefty, or in any other manner that his difcretion might fuggeft. He then moved an humble Address, but no perfon feconded it, and the Motion fell to the ground.

HIS MAJESTY'S MESSAGE.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer brought up a Meffage from the King. [See page 193.]

Mr. Pitt oblerved, that he did not confider it neceffary, at this time, to propofe any fpecific measure. He hould content himself merely with moving, That his Majesty's Meffage be taken into confideration to-morrow. He conceived it, however, to be his duty to ftate, that, in addition to the Motion for an Addrefs on the Royal communication, it would be neceffary to proceed to the appointment of a Committee, to examine the general ftate of the affairs of the Bank of England. He was confident that it would appear,

frem a very fhort examination of the ftate of the Bank, that not a doubt could be entertained of its folidity and refponfibility being equal to that of any former period; that, not only was the Bank equal to answer the utmost extent of the demands against it, but that there was an abundance far beyond any demand that could be made; yet he was fatisfied that every Member would agree with him, that, under the prefent circumftances, it would be highly expedient to declare by law, that the ouifanding engagements of the Bank of England should be confidered as secured by the National faith of the Country; and that an Act should be paffed, declaring that to be the law which already was the practice, viz. that their Notes thould be received in every branch of public payment. This meafure, he was fatisfied, would, in addition to the proof which an investigation of the affairs of the Bank would give of the folidity of their refources, neceffarily operate as a confirmation of their ability to anfwer every demand. He did not think it his duty to expatiate farther at prefent. It was enough that he had apprized the Houfe of his intention to propofe thofe measures which feemed to him to require the most urgent attention. trusted the Houfe would be induced to enforce, by a law, the restriction which had been recommended to the Bank not to make payments in cash, except in fuch cafes as might be thought neceffary to permit. Having explained the nature and tendency of the meafures, he concluded by moving, That the Message be taken into confideration to-morrow,

He

iniquitous practices that had reduced us to our prefent deplorable condition would be duly weighed, and impartially decided upon. He did not mean to enter into the particulars of the queftion until it came fairly before the House to-morrow; but deeming the propofition of the Hon. Gentleman to be of the greatest importance, he hoped that a Committee would be appointed to enquire into the whole of the circumftances which had combined to render the adoption of fo extraordinary a measure of urgent neceffity to the existence of the public credit of Great Britain.

Mr. Alderman Combe then asked, whether Notes were to be rendered legal tenders in mercantile or other tranfactions between individuals?

The Chancellor of the Exchequer replied, that he had already given notice of every thing that he was then at liberty to ftate. Whatever should be deemed practicable, it was certainly his intention to make legal.

Mr. Sheridan faid, the ftoppage of payment of the Bank, whether a meafure of neceffity or not, was entirely an expedient of the Minifter's, and the Directors had been called upon to obey an order to that effect. A proceeding fo alarming demanded immediate attention, and he did expect that fome plan would have been immediately brought forward to fanction fo extraor dinary a measure. The Right Hon. Gentleman had stated, that the most falutary effects had already been derived from it, and that one of the advantages obtained by it was a confiderable rife this day in the price of ftocks: a fpecies of reafoning which he conceived as too abfurd to be entertained for a moment. He rejoiced to hear that the affairs of the Bank were in a fafe condition; he had little doubt of the fact, and he was moreover convinced that the neceflity of making its Notes legal payment would never have exifted, if the Bank had not been fo long identified with the Government. It did not require to be explained what the caufe of the prefent alarming fituation of the Country was owing to. We all knew that the fhip had fprung a moft dangerous leak, but it remained to be hereafter determined what was to become of the Pilot. After all the profeffions which we had heard from him of the flourishing ftate of our finances, and after the repeated boasts made by him

of the impoffibility of their ever being injured, what faith can be placed in his declarations, or what reliance is to be placed on his judgment?-Mr. Sheridan concluded by handing the following Motion to the Chair:

"That no farther exportation of fpecie or coin to the Emperor, or any other foreign Prince, hall take place until the fenfe of Parliament, upon a full review of the prefent exigencies, thall be afcertained."

Mr. Nichol feconded the Motion in a short but very warm fpeech, and was very fevere on Mr. Pitt in his obfervations upon his former boaftings of confding majorities, who he thought would foon have reafon to repent of their fervile confidence.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer expreffed himself not fo much astonished at the Motion which had been made, as he was at the conduct of the Learned Gentleman who had feconded it. If a Motion of the prefent nature should be carried before we afcertained that there was

no probability of a favourable change, it would be declaring to the enemy that we were determined to abandon the Emperor; a circumftance which would not fail to produce the moft mifchievous and dangerous confequences, as well to Great Britain as to her Ally. Under thefe considerations he should move the Order of the Day.

Mr. Fox faid a fcarcity of Cal had been experienced at former periods, and particularly in the year 1793; yet at that period the Bank of England had experienced no difficulty. From what then could this difference arife, but from the immenfe exports which had been made to the Continent? Why then were the Hufe to confide that the Minifter would not do that which he, had already done? The whole of the bufinefs must be brought before the public eye. That Houfe would betray their duty to their conftituents if they did not act as confidering the business in this point of view. They would, by any other conduct, make themfelves acceffaries to all the confequences, or, in other words, to the certain ruin of the Country.

Mr. Dundas complained of a want of candour on the oppofite fide of the Houfe.

Sir W. Milner faid, at a moment when the Bank of England had stopped payment, and when almost every other Bank in the Country had violated the

implied