would have any bad effect; but on the plied. He said, we were determined to persist in a war with America; it had been called a just war, a necessary war; and the hon. gentleman who spoke before him had gone over the grounds of its commencement, the equity of its continuance, and the necessity of our perseverance in terms of the highest aggravation, Four several motives, says he, have been mentioned, for the commencement, progress, continuance and perseverance of Debate on the Duke of Richmond's Mothe war: 1. It was begun on purpose, tion for an Enquiry into the State of the "to quell a puny insurrection:" 2. It was Nation.] Dec. 2. The Duke of Richproceeded in "to subdue a dangerous re- mond. My lords; I am happy to have bellion;" 3. It was continued, " to defend given notice on Friday last, of the motion ourselves"-positively from the motive of with which I intended to trouble your lordse defendendo from the fear, that if we ships to day; because it proves my wish do not kill them, they will us. And 4. It that the State of the Nation might be conmust be persevered in from a motive the sidered, independent of any events that most strange, perhaps, that ever entered might befall our arms. I have on a forinto the thoughts of a rational people. mer occasion said, that whatever those He would give the whole committee, he events might be, they must equally contrisaid, two guesses, and the chairman three, bute to make us desire an end of the preand be bound that they would not guess it sent ruinous war. Should the most brilright. It was indeed a laughable, a ludicrous liant successes attend us, should American motive-it must be persevered in, adds resistance be annihilated, we must still be he, "to gain their confidence." We are sorry to see Englishmen under the edge to beat them, it seems, in order to con- of the sword, and governed by a military ciliate them! Such are the romantic rea-power. But no such event is possible, sons assigned for this war; from the con- Should disgrace, therefore, take place, it clusion of which, no benefit was to be ex- would only confirm what has been so often pected, nor revenue arise; and yet upon foretold here, that a reduction of America which there had been more money ex- by force of arms is impossible. pended than would have served to have should the operations be chequered by purchased, taken in, cleared, inclosed, failures and undecisive successes, altermanured, cultivated, sown, and planted all nately, our affairs will then be in the worst the waste lands in Britain-more than condition, as we shall be tempted to furwould have turned all the heaths, hills, ther trials, which will exhaust us still and wastes into gardens; and from the more, and from the nature of things cancultivation of which, nay, if they had not prosper in the present undertaking, been all sown with barley, from the malt- I am told that news is arrived. Till it is tax alone, a greater revenue would have made public, I cannot comment upon it, been drawn, than all the taxation that But be it good, bad, or indifferent, it can ever be gathered from the wide con- ought not to prevent your lordships from tinent of America. Such were the mo-entering seriously into the enquiry I mean effects of this war; to propose an enquiry into the state of called upon to grant the nation, I am sure your lordships cannot say that such an enquiry is unneces sary. When a civil war rages with uncommon violence, and has rent the empire asunder: when the whole force of the kingdom, and all we can hire, are unable to restore quiet; when we are adding enormously to a debt already enormous, and there is no prospect of a happy issue, tives, and such the and for this we were the present supply, Or Mr, For observed he would let slip no opportunity of speaking his sentiments on the present measures: he therefore begged to propose two queries: 1. Whether after two years fruitless war, administration had given the slightest reason to that House, to satisfy them that there was a probability of putting an end to the un-it cannot be said that no enquiry is neceshappy contest? 2. Whether a declaration from administration, informing the Americans that it was not their wish to violate their charters, or rob them of their liberties, sary, because all goes on smoothly and well, That a most unnatural civil war does exist, that we are expending treasures of men and money, and that we seem far fices may or may not be properly and safely disclosed; consistently with the interest of the nation, and the safety of individuals. If the noble duke entertains such an intention, I shall most certainly resist any proposition tending that way. It would be imprudent and impolitic, and would be directly contrary to his grace's avowed object, that of promoting the public welfare. ther than ever from the situation we left, are what every one must acknowledge. Does it not, then, become the nation to enquire, in the most solemn manner possible, how we came into this situation? For what we are contending? What the contest cost us? And what prospect there is of a happy end? We have certainly had very little information, and it must be allowed that wisdom, especially in times of difficulty, requires us to proceed upon a The Duke of Richmond. By no means: thorough knowledge of every circum- I do not wish for any improper or dangerstance that may lead us to judge rightly. ous information; and to avoid a possibiWe must first be sure that our cause is lity of even the appearance of any thing just, then enquire into our means, the like- of the kind, the motions I intend to sublihood of success, the degree to which it mit to your lordships shall all have a remay be pursued, and whether that degree trospective view; they will be framed so of success is worth the certain loss and as to call forth matter already known to great risk to which we expose ourselves our enemies; matter known to perhaps in the pursuit? In times like these, the every other person, who may have made nation has a right to be informed of the it his business to discover it, but to both true state of its affairs, and parliament be- Houses of Parliament. They will chiefly. ing the regular and authentic channel of be directed to two points; to the state of such information, it is the duty of parlia- our army and navy; and the expences of ment to give it. An enquiry into the the war previous to the first of August state of the nation is very extensive; it last. I shall first move for the Returns of includes every thing. I hope therefore the several military corps and marines that every one of your lordships in the serving on shore, which have suffered by least used to business, will lend his assist- death, wounds, captivity, sickness, or deance in prosecuting those branches that sertion, from the commencement of 1774, may appear most important. One object to the 1st August, 1777, in America.-2. may strike one, and another another. The A list of ships and armed vessels, and the enquiry will be open to all. But as it may number of men who suffered, as in the be expected I should in some degree point former motion, by death, wounds, capout for what purpose I paarticularly move tivity, sickness, and desertion.-3. The it, I shall, without excluding myself from last returns from the hospitals of the sick, any other subject, or from what shall arise wounded, and dead.-4. A list of the from the materials laid before us, readily ships and armed vessels employed as conexplain what I have principally in view. voys.-5. An account of his Majesty's It is, to state to the nation what this war, ships of war, which have been employed so far as it has gone, has already cost us since the passing of the Prohibition Act, in blood and treasure; to enquire into the as cruisers, for the protection of this kingconduct of it, and the measures taken for dom and Ireland; the station of such restoring peace. For these purposes I ships, and how long ordered to continue shall move that several accounts and pa- on such cruizes: with the times of their pers be laid before the House; and that going to sea, and returning into port, so there may be time to weigh them, I shall far as relates to such ships as are actually not move that the day for going into this returned into port.-6. The last accounts consideration be before the holidays; nor of the state of the army in this kingdom, yet immediately after, lest there should not-7. The state of the army in Ireland. be time to prepare any other papers which 8. The state of the army in America, may then seem necessary. I therefore distinguishing the number of British and move your lordships, to resolve that this foreign troops. The motions were all House will take into consideration the agreed to. State of the Nation on Monday the 2d of February next. The Earl of Suffolk. I presume the noble duke does not mean to infringe upon the right which the King's servants have, of judging of what in their respective of The Earl of Chatham rose and said: My lords; I most cheerfully testify my approbation of the motions now made by the noble duke; and am firmly persuaded, that they have originated in the most exalted motives: nor am I less pleased with the very candid reception they have met with from your lordships. I think they will draw forth a great mass of useful information; but as to those respecting the state of our military strength, there appears something yet wanting to render them complete. Nothing has been offered which may lead to inform us of the actual state of the garrisons of Gibraltar and Minorca, those two very important fortresses, which have hitherto enabled us to maintain our superiority in the Mediterranean, and one of them (Gibraltar) situated on the very continent of Spain, the best proof of our naval power, and the only solid check on that of the House of Bourbon; yet those two important fortresses are left to chance and the pacific dispositions of France and Spain, as the only protection; we hold them but by sufferance. I know them to be in a defenceless state. None of your lordships are ignorant that we lost Mahon at the commencement of the last war. It was indeed a fatal disaster, as it exposed the trade and commerce of the Mediterranean to the ravages of our inveterate and then powerful enemies. My lords, such was the light the acquisition of that fortress was looked upon when it was first taken, that the duke of Marlborough, who was no great penman, but who employed a secretary to draw up his dispatches, in answer to the letter from the able general and consummate statesman who conquered it (the father of my noble relation now in my eye, earl Stanhope) trusted the dispatch to the secretary, but added a postscript in his own hand-writing, where he recommended particularly to the victorious general, by no means to neglect putting that fortress in the best possible state of defence, and to garrison it with natives, and not foreigners, When I had the honour, soon after it fell into the hands of the French, to be called into the councils of the late king, I never lost sight of that circumstance. Gibraltar still remained in our hands; and the war in Germany, which parliament thought fit to engage in, and bind themselves to, before I came into office; though we were carrying on the most extensive operations in America; though the coast of Africa, and the West India islands, required a suitable force to protect them; and though these kingdoms called for a proportionate army, not only to act defensively, but offensively on the egasts of our enemies; notwithstanding all those pressing services, my lords, having the counsel of that great man constantly in view, it determined me, that whatever demands, or how much soever such troops might be wanting elsewhere, that Gibraltar should never want a full and adequate defence. I never had, my lords, less than eight battalions to defend it. I think a battalion was then about 800 strong. So that, my lords, I affirm, that Gibraltar was never trusted to a garrison of less than 6,000 men. My lords, this force was, as it were, locked up in that fortress during the whole of the late war; nor could any appearance of the most urgent necessity induce me to weaken it. My lords, I know that the very weak and defenceless state of these islands does not seem to admit of any troops being spared from the home defence; but, my lords, give me leave to say, that whatever reluctance or disgust there may have appeared in several veteran and able generals to the service, where the tomahawk and scalping-knife were to be the warlike instruments employed as the engines of destruction, I am convinced there are many, some of whom I have in my eye, [supposed to mean lords Townshend and Amherst] who would with ardour and alacrity accept of any command, where the true honour, interest, and safety of their country were concerned. My lords, the moment is arrived when this spirit should be exerted. Gibraltar is garrisoned by Hanoverians. I am told, if any accident should happen to the present commanding officer there, that the care of the fortress, and the command of the troops, would devolve on a foreigner. I do not recollect his name, but this is my information; and if I do not hear it contradicted, I must take it for granted. am well authorised to say, my lords, that such is the present defenceless state of Gibraltar, that there is not a second relief in case of an attack; not men sufficient to man the works, while those fatigued with service and watching go to refresh, eat, or sleep; though Germany and the wilds of America have been ransacked for the purpose. I My lords, we should not want men in a good cause; and nothing ought to be left untried to procure them. I remember, soon after the period I shall take the liberty to remind your lordships of, after an unnatural rebellion had been extinguished in the northern part of this island, men not fighting for liberty, or the constitution of their country, but professedly to anni. precisely as he would persuade your lordships to believe; will his lordship pretend to affirm, that 35 ships of the line, or even 42 (the highest that his lordship ventured to go) would, in case of a rupture with the House of Bourbon, be sufficient for all the purposes of offence, defence, and protection? I am sure his lordship will not. A fleet in the Channel; one in the Western Sea; another in the West Indies; and one in the Mediterranean; besides convoys and cruizers, to protect our commerce and annoy our enemies. I say, my lords, that 35 ships of the line would be necessary for the protection of our trade and fortresses in the Mediterranean alone. We must be equal to the combined force of France and Spain in that sea, or we need not send a single ship there. Ships must be stationed to command respect from the powers on the coast of Barbary, and to prevent their piracies on our merchant vessels. We must have a superior fleet in the Western Sea likewise, and we must have one in the Channel equal to the defence of hilate both, as advocates for popery, slavery, and arbitrary power; not like our brethren in America, Whigs in principle, and heroes in conduct: I remember, I say, my lords, that I employed these very rebels in the service and defence of their country. They were reclaimed by this means; they fought our battles, they cheerfully bled in defence of those liberties which they attempted to overthrow but a few years before. What, then, does your lordships imagine would be the effect of a similar conduct towards the Whigs and freemen of America, whom you call rebels! Would it not, think you, operate in like manner? They would fight your battles; they would cheerfully bleed for you; they would render you superior to all your foreign enemies; they would bear your arms triumphant to every quarter of the globe. You have, I fear, lost the affection, the good will of this people, by employing mercenary Germans to butcher them; by spiriting up the savages of America to scalp them with the tomahawk. My lords, I would have you consider, should this war be pushed to extremities, the possible consequences. It is no farther from America to England than from England to America. If conquest is to be the issue, we must trust to that issue, and fairly abide by it. The noble earl at the head of the Admiralty, the last night I had the honour to address your lordships, contradicted me when I asserted we had not above 20 ships of the line fit to proceed to sea, (on actual service) at a short warning. I again repeat the assertion, though I gave it up at that time, on account of the plausibility and confidence with which the fact was asserted. I now say, there are not above 20 ships of the line on which any naval officer of eminence and skill in his profession would stake his credit. The noble earl in office said, there were 35 ships of the line fit for sea; but acknowledged, that there was a deficiency of near 3,000 of the complements necessary to proceed upon actual service. How did the noble earl propose to fill up that deficiency?-By supernumeraries, by transfers, by recruits, &c. Will the noble earl say, that 21,000 is a full war complement for 35 ships of the line? or will he undertake to assure this House (even allowing for those odds and ends) that the ships will be properly manned by the numbers now actually on board? But if every parcular fact, stated by the noble earl, be our own coast. These were the ideas which prevailed, when I had the honour of assisting in the British councils, and at all other preceding periods of naval hostility since the RevoÏution. My lords, if lord Anson was capable of the high office the noble earl now presides in, the noble earl is certainly mistaken in saying, that 35 or 55 ships of the line are equal to the several services now enumerated. That great naval commander gave in a list, at one time, of 84,000 seamen actually on the books. It is well worthy your lordships' inquiry, to know what are the present number. The motion made by the noble duke leads to that inquiry, and meets my warmest approbation; but that we may have every necessary information, I recommend to my noble friend to amend his motion by extending it to Gibraltar and Mahon. I do not wish to have any thing disclosed at present, which may tend to expose the weak state of those fortresses; but I think it incumbent on your lordships to learn their strength, in point of numbers of men; and to know how the fact stands, relative to the possibility of the command of Gibraltar devolving on a foreigner, in case of any accident happening to the officer who now commands there. The Earl of Sandwich said, he asserted on the occasion alluded to, nothing but the truth; that he never meant to mislead; that he was an honest man; and have so powerful a fleet in the Mediterranean. It was not the case during his lordship's own administration, nor during any other preceding, the one mentioned excepted. If the noble earl is urged to speak from secret intelligence, to recommend a more full and complete naval armament, let his lordship speak out; it is his duty to do so, that we may be prepared. If the House of Bourbon has any such intention, I shall take care to have our fleet equal to any attempt they may think proper to make. I repeat, that we have 54 ships of the line ready for sea, and that with the ships of the line in ordinary, we could, before the end of the year, be able to send 90 line of battle ships to sea. Viscount Townshend observed, that Gibraltar had, at no preceding time, been in so complete a state of defence, and when the works were all finished, it would be rendered in a great measure impregnable. It was long known, and complained of, that we held Gibraltar only by the superiority of our navy; the defences next the sea being very weak; consequently, that it was liable to be surprized at any time on the commencement of a war with France and Spain. That had, however, when he asserted what he knew was right, he would be brow-beaten by no man. He acknowledged the superior abilities of the noble earl; but when facts were in question, which he knew to be true, he would give way to no authority, however high or respectable. As to the deficiency of the complements of the 35 line of battle ships, when he said they could be filled up by supernumeraries, he was justified in say. ing so; and by the manner the noble lord understood the word, 'supernumeraries,' it was plain he was ignorant of the term; they were not the outcast or refuse of the navy; nor made by transfers from one ship to another; they might be as able seamen as any in the navy: the truth was, that the complements of several ships exceeded their rates; so that every man borne in each ship, more than what was always allowed to man a ship of that rate, is a supernumerary. They were composed of able and ordinary seamen; they might have been pressed, or have entered voluntarily into the service. His lordship said, it was extremely unparliamentary, to argue upon expressions which had fallen in a former debate. He did not however wish to avail himself of that long-established usage. He said then, and he now re-been lately provided against; new works peated, that we had a navy fully adequate of great strength had been raised; and to meet the whole force of the House of they had been so constructed, as to give Bourbon, in the first instance; and should cover to a regiment in the event of a siege; they entertain any hostile intentions, the and so situated as to be nearly central, remainder of our force was in such a state and to enable the reliefs to proceed to of preparation as would render it much their several posts with little or no danger superior to any France and Spain could from the enemy's fire. On the subject of send against us. France and Spain had employing savages, he said it was imposarmed some time since, so did we. Those sible to make war in America, without armaments have been increased, so have them. They served as scouts and spies to ours. We are in a state of preparation; bring intelligence. In such a country as whenever further appearances justify us, America, covered with woods, and interwe must keep pace with our neighbours. sected by rivers, lakes and morasses, they The noble carl had laid great stress, that could not be well done without; where, the Mediterranean alone would call for a indeed, it might be possible for two armies naval force, equal to the whole of the though a short space asunder to know no ships ready for service. He could hardly more of each other, than if they were on think that; the greatest fleet ever sent opposite sides of the globe. The queen upon that service, was under Matthews of Hungary, and several other European and Lestock, during the war preceding powers, employed Croats, Pandours, Grasthe last. The noble earl would, he hoped, sines, and various denominations of irrerecollect, that that ficet had many other gular troops, during the late and former objects besides the protection of the Me-wars; yet he never heard their conduct diterranean commerce, or of Gibraltar and Mahon. It was sent there to facilitate the operations of our allies in Italy; to protect the king of Sardinia's and the empress queen's dominions. But from that single instance, he presumed, the noble earl would not infer that we should always + arraigned in such a manner, nor were they charged as the authors of murder, rapine, &c. The Indians were employed by the noble lord then near him (lord Amherst) so they were by himself; not for the purposes presumed by the noble earl, but solely for those he had mentioned. |