Oldalképek
PDF
ePub

our trade laws, was not of light consideration; and ought not to be hurried on in a sudden and indecent manner. Besides, the petitions on the table deserved particular attention; the petitioners were men of a description entitled to respect, and a patient hearing; and he would appeal to the candour of gentlemen on every side of the House, whether now, on the 6th of May, was a proper time to enter into so laborious and important an investigation? He professed the best disposition towards the whole Irish nation; said, he was ready to concur, at any time, in whatever might promote the true interest of that country; and if the amendment which he meant to propose should meet the sentiments of the House, he would move for a committee, before the House rose, to take into consideration, early in the next session, the restrictive laws on the trade of Ireland; and do all in his power to forward the interests of that country, where they did not immediately interfere with those of England. He concluded by moving, "That the Bill be read a second time upon this day three months."

Sir Thomas Egerton seconded the' motion. He said the loss to Manchester, in checks only, if these Bills passed, would be 100,000l. annually; he begged the House would at least hear counsel for the different petitioning towns, before they passed them; and agreed in recommending the Irish trade to be referred to a committee, of which he would readily make one, and give it all the attention and assistance in his power.

Mr. T. Townshend said, the proposition of going into a committee, was little better than a direct negative. It held out no security, but a vague promise to move a committee, which committee would appoint another committee. On these grounds, he entirely disapproved of the Amendment.

Earl Nugent particularly adverted to the motives which had actuated the petitioners against the Bills, and in a peculiar manner he spoke to the conduct of the city of Glasgow, who had, with the most illiberal sentiments, prayed that neither the present, nor any future advantage should be granted to Ireland, that might, in the least degree, operate to the disadvantage of Britain. He could not, he said, bestow upon this conduct a term vile enough; it was mean, unmanly, ungenerous, despicable, and even diabolical. Sir Adam Ferguson defended the city

of Glasgow, against the charge of having entertained diabolical motives. He read the petition, and spoke highly in favour of the liberality and philanthropy of the Glasgow merchants, at the same time saying, they so far gave preference to their own, before any foreign country, that they could not see its interests violated, as they imagined, without exerting their endeavours to prevent it. If the Bills passed into a law, the city of Glasgow would in a particular manner, be affected. They had, in common with the rest of Scotland, embarked in the same bottom with England, and become liable to a proportion of the national debt, for the sake of enjoying an equality of commerce. On that foundation they had laid out immense sums of money in the cultivation of the sugar-trade; they had considered it as an hereditary right, depending on the security of the acts in their favour; and it was, in a great degree, their only property and wealth. A great part of their annual returns flowed from Ireland, and they would be most materially injured if that kingdom should participate the trade with them. He considered the present Bills as improper on another account. By their passing, they would stand in the way of an Union, which he considered as the only solid basis of equality that could be built upon. He therefore hoped the House would agree to the amendment.

Viscount Midleton said, he had heard that the people of Manchester and Liverpool had determined, nothwithstanding their late exertions, to be no longer loyal if these Bills should pass. He was sensible that these towns, as well as Glasgow, were experienced in rebellion so abundantly, that the transition would be an ob ject of easy accomplishment, and the world would entertain little surprize if they threw aside their new-fangled opinion. He could not enough wonder, that the hon. gentleman should, of all men, plead the hereditary right of the city of Glasgow to the commerce of the English, on the principle of having taken upon themselves a proportion of the national debt. He thought a gentleman of that country ought to have been silent upon that head.

Lord North was of opinion, that as the expectations of the Irish were raised from what the House had already done, it would be unwise to protract the business to another session. The gentlemen who opposed the Bill seemed all to agree in one

ment and loyalty to the government of this country. Such had been her conduct, and her reward had been restriction and bondage of the most cruel nature. He did not mean, he said, by describing her situation, to engage the humanity of the House in her favour: he knew very well they were but poor resources. The people of Ireland would not accept of 'favours flowing from the humanity of the House. They called for justice, not for pity. They requested Britain to be wise, not to be generous; to provide for her own good, and secure her own interest, sensible that wisdom and prudence would dictate, that to accomplish these, a contrary conduct towards them was necessary.

The hon. gentlemen who opposed the Bill, had drawn into collection the arguments and reasons they maintained to exist against all the Bills, meaning, no

point, that something ought to be done for their relief, though they differed about the nature and extent of what ought to be done. He saw no reason, however, why the present Bill should not pass, since the House might, notwithstanding, appoint a committee to enquire into the state of the trade, that from their report a plan might be adopted. He did not see the mighty difficulty that was said to exist, in calculating the difference necessarily to arise in the annual imports, by the effect of the Bill before the House. It would create small difference, comparatively speaking, in the revenue, since the diminution in the imports of one place would give an addition to those of another, as the difference of duty on the enumerated articles was very trifling. He held it as the duty of Britain to give Ireland a degree, at least, of recompence for the exertions she had made, supposing we were not inclined, in policy, to give her relief from the restric-doubt, thereby to prejudice the House the tions she laboured under, and he hoped the House would agree to the present Bill, as a test of their intention and inclination to befriend her more substantially in future. Mr. Burke rose to answer the arguments of the hon. gentlemen who opposed the Bill. The Bills before the House, he said, were no more than restorations of what the wisdom of a British parliament had, on a former occasion, thought proper to invest Ireland with. In the 12th of Charles 2, the Navigation Bills passed, extending to Ireland as well as England. A kind of left-handed policy had, however, deprived her of the freedom she had enjoyed under that Act, and she had ever since remained under the most cruel, oppressive, and unnatural restriction. Deprived of every incentive to industry, and shut out from every passage to wealth, she had inwardly lamented, but she had never complained of her condition. She had gone the most forward lengths in serving the interests, and in defending the rights of Great Britain. She had assisted in conquests, from which she was to gain no advantage, and emptied her treasury, and desolated her land, to prove her attach

* "Mr. Burke was the great and powerful supporter of the Bills in point of debate. His situation was rather singular, and undoubtedly embarrassing. For he received his seat in parliament, without expence, from the free votes and predilection of the citizens of Bristol in his favour, and his constituents now thought their interests materially affected by the Bills in question." Annual Register.

more by their aggregate effect. Though he detested this inequitable mode of proceeding, he would not evade the combat even on that ground, nor wish to engage the House in favour of the Bills, if he could not, in the fullest manner, answer every objection they had brought to every part. The hon. gentleman who had moved the amendment, wished to reconcile the people of Ireland to delay, by pledging the honour of parliament, that something effectual should be done in their favour next session. He knew the temper of the Irish too well, to believe that they would sit down satisfied with such an assertion. They would conclude within themselves, depending on experience for their guide, that the promise of something to be done next session, would alone produce the repetition of a promise for the session following; and promise, repetition, and promise, from session to session, would be the only benefit they would receive. He did not conclude, that the denial of what even justice demanded of us in their favour, would produce rebellion and disturbance in that country; their loyalty and zeal was superior to complaint; they might despair, but they would not resist. Other places, experienced in rebellion, had determined, it seems, to enter or not to enter into it, according as these Bills were determined!; but Ireland regarded more the welfare of the empire at large than the interest of itself in particular. They were patient and loyal, and therefore, he supposed, they

of an equality. And as the ability of proceeding will increase in the same proportion, in the progress of the one and of the other, the same proportion of advantage will still remain. The Irish will be able to follow the English at an equal distancé in every stage, both in the outset and in the continuance; but they will never be able to accelerate their motion so as to overtake them.

He said, the supposed operation of the cheapness of labour with respect to manufactures was totally unfounded, and the arguments founded thereon nugatory; and that until the instant that the price of labour was equal in both countries, the superiority of manufacture would remain with the English. That the price of labour rises with the growth of manufac ture, and is highest when the manufacture is best. is best. And that the experience of every day tells us, that where the price of labour is highest, the manufacturer is able to sell his commodity at the lowest price. He observed, that the difference of duty on some of the enumerated imported articles, was so abundantly overbalanced by the other advantages enjoyed by this country, that without it, there could not be the smallest degree of competition in manufacture on the side of Ireland; nor could that in any degree hurt England. They had, he said, a strange opinion of the extent of the world, who believed that there was not room enough in it for the trade of two such islands as these.

were crushed; for it was the policy of the present day to forego the excellent and noble maxim of the Romans, "parcere subjectis et debellare superbos," for the infamous proverb of British growth, " Proud to the humble, and humble to the proud." He then went into a particular detail of the arguments of the hon. gentlemen relating to commercial advantage. The annual revenue of the two kingdoms, he said, had been exultingly, but most inequitably, drawn into comparison, to prove that Ireland paid no proportion of tax. It was not the number of inhabitants that constituted the specific difference in the article of taxation between two countries; but the distinction of internal opulence and external advantage. Compare the two countries by that line, and it will be found that Ireland is taxed in a quadruple proportion more than England. The internal wealth, and the external advantage of trade and commerce are forty times greater in England than in Ireland. There is, therefore, no ratio of proportion in the mode of taxing the latter. She is taxed without enjoying the means of payment. There are several excises which England is subject to, and which she is not. Suppose them laid: they must be laid for the sake of oppression, not production; and for the benefit of the officers, not of the revenue. Leather is taxed in England-but what would be the product of such a tax, where such innumerable multitudes of the people never wear shoes? You tax candles in England. But there are two hundred thousand houses in Ireland, in which probably a candle, such as you tax, was never lighted. The taxes must follow wealth, and not precede it. If any attempt against this rule is made, there will neither be wealth nor taxes. This, he said, was the order of nature; which must be followed. And as to the judgment of the proportion, it must be left to themselves, or they are not free; and surely the fault of the parliament of Ireland has never been illiberality in its grants. Restricted from trading, she enjoys no opportunity of acquiring wealth to defray and discharge the taxes imposed upon her. Enlarge her means of payment, and, in pr portion to her ability, she will enlarge her taxes. An equality of commercial advantage could not be established between the two countries. The opulence of the one is a great obstacle to the other. The great disproportion of capital effectually destroys the possibility [VOL. XIX.]

He observed, that most, if not all of the petitions on the table, tended to express the utmost fears of the consequences that would arise from granting a free exporta. tion of sail-cloth and iron to the Irish. At the same time the real matter of fact is, that the Irish have long possessed, without being able to turn it to any advantage worth mention, the free exportation of manufactured iron and steel, as well as of sail-cloth. From hence it is evident, that the petitioners have not felt from the reality what they dreaded in the idea; and it is fairly to be inferred, that the other matters of apprehension contained in the petitions are as groundless as these; and are only founded, like them, upon mere conjecture. | It also appears evidently, that the advantages possessed by the English are so far superior in these respects, that the Irish were not able to prosecute these manufactures to any purpose, nor consequently to turn their liberty of exportation to ac count. And this, he said, was so truly the [4 C]

Tellers.

} 126

fact, that every species of iron manufacture, in particular, was actually exported in incredible quantities to Ireland.

He shewed from other instances, as well as the present, how hastily and erroneously manufacturers are liable to form their opinions upon subjects of this nature; and upon what slight grounds alarms are raised, and apprehensions propagated amongst them. Particularly, when, some years ago, a Bill was brought in for the free importation of woollen yarn from Ireland, an universal alarm was excited, and petitions were sent in from every quarter, stating and complaining of the ruinous. consequences which it would produce; the Bill, however, passed into a law, and now, upon a full experience of its effects, they both feel and acknowledge its beneficial tendency. But it was absurd, he said, to think that a participation of manufacture would be detrimental to this country. Had we not seen the woollen manufactory planted in different parts of this country; and had we not also seen that it throve by the competition?

He concluded with lamenting that it could happen in any one instance, that his conscience should direct him to take a part contrary to the opinion of his constituents. It had been his invariable aim to protect their rights and interests, and to act at all times as became the senator and representative of the people. In this instance he had dared to act contrary to the wishes, though, he was sensible, not to the interests, of his constituents. And if, from his conduct in this business, he should be deprived of his seat in that House, as he apprehended he might, his conduct being disapproved by many of his chief friends and supporters, as well as by all who had opposed him at his election, he had the satisfaction of being perfectly assured, that he should suffer in the very cause of those who had inflicted the punishment. He should not blame them if they did reject him; the event would afford a very useful example; on the one hand, of a senator inflexibly adhering to his opinion against interest, and against popularity; and, on the other, of constituents exercising their undoubted right of rejection; not on corrupt motives, but from their persuasion, that he whom they had chosen had acted against the judgment and interest of those he represented. The question being put, That the Bill be now read a second time, the House divided:

[blocks in formation]

NOES {Sir Cecil Wray
Sir Thomas Egerton

[blocks in formation]

Sir Cecil Wray's Amendment was consequently lost; and the Bill was read a second time. After which, Counsel were heard on behalf of the Petitions against the Bills. They were again heard on the 13th.

May 19. The House went into a Committee on the Irish Importation Bill.

Mr. Gascoyne, when the enumerated articles came to be necessarily mentioned, in order to fill up the blanks, moved, That woollens, woollen cloths, whole or mixed cotton, and cotton goods, whole or mixed painted and printed linens, gun. powder, and several other articles of inferior consequence, be exempted. He next moved, That whatever goods or merchandize, &c. which should be permitted to be exported under this Act, should have duties laid upon any of them, or the ingredients which composed them, equal to those already subsisting in Great Britain, and likewise of any of the said export duties. This clause being agreed to, sir W. Bagot proposed a clause, that no iron, manufactured, should be permitted to be exported under this Act, till a duty of 2. 10s. per ton be laid upon all foreign iron imported into Ireland. These clauses being agreed to, sir T. Egerton moved, That the liberty given by this Act to export checks from Ireland, do not take place till the parliament of Ireland shall take off the duty of one halfpenny perpound on all linen yarn exported from that kingdom.

The question being put, the committee divided; Ayes 33, Noes 79.

May 25. The House resumed the adjourned debate upon the motion made on the 15th instant," That the Bill to permit the importation of certain goods from the British plantations in America, or the Bri tish settlements on the coast of Africa, into the kingdom of Ireland, be com mitted."

Sir George Yonge moved, "That the debate be further adjourned till this day two months."

Lord Newhaven said, he was anxious to embrace the first moment to convince the House, that his dividing the House about a week ago on this question did not pro

the commerce of the western world; but all this shall avail you nothing; America shall be exempt from taxation, they shall be the arbitrary despots of their own soil; but Ireland must continue for ever to smart under the proscribing hand of Great Britain.

The House divided, on sir G. Yonge's motion: the Yeas went forth.

Tellers for the Yeas, sir G. Yonge,

Lord Newhaven was appointed one of the Tellers for the Noes; but no other member remaining in the House to be a second Teller for the Noes, the Yeas returned into the House; and Mr. Speaker declared the Yeas had it. So the ques tion was resolved in the affirmative.

June 2. Earl Nugent declared it to be his intention, early in the next session, to move for the Irish Importation Bill; and for this plain reason, because the Export Bill, without it, would avail them nothing. Ireland could not afford to give long credit, which, however, she must be necessitated to do, unless in her commerce with our plantations she was permitted to barter for, and import their commodities: contend ing at the same time, that their present national necessities demanded this indulgence of the English parliament.

ceed from a desire to give trouble, but to
comply with the conviction of his own
mind; thinking it much better to deter-
mine the fate of the Bill there than to feed
the hopes of the people of Ireland for ten
days longer, and then reject it; which
could only aggravate the disappointment,
if it did not pass into a law. That, if it
did not pass, he must lament that it ever
came into the House; for, as it had not
the most favourable reception, the expec-sir P. J. Clerke:
tations of the people of Ireland were raised
to the highest pitch, and would now be
plunged into the deepest despair. That,
while nothing was done, they still had hope
to cherish them, that some time or other
something might be done; but if this Bill
was rejected, the curtain of despair must
be drawn on their hopes for ever. That
the evidence at the bar and the counsel
who pleaded for them urged, that if this
Bill passed it would take something from
England; though in the same breath they
tell you that something ought to be done
for Ireland: but that that something must
not be any thing taken from England.
Arguments too absurd, futile, and ridicu-
lous to be seriously refuted. He said, he
had read all the petitions upon the table
against this and the other Bills, in which
were enumerated various articles in which
the petitioners thought they would be in-
jured; but at the same time they sum up
the whole of their apprehensions and ter-
rors in this one sweeping objection; that
from the cheapness of labour the Irish
would underself them at all foreign mar-
kets. He urged, if this argument was ad-
mitted, and that Ireland was never to re-
ceive any benefit till Great Britain could
work as cheap as her, it must strike every
man that Ireland can never receive any
indulgence from England; and without
advantage in trade Ireland must ever re-
main in its present state of indigence, and
labour be for ever cheaper than in Eng-
land. All which shewed clearly that the
postponing the Bill could gain it no advo-
cates; for the argument of the petitioners
against it would be the same next year as
this, and so on for ever, while the poverty
of Ireland and the jealousy of England
existed. That if this Bill was rejected, it
was at once telling the people of Ireland,
You have soil, you have climate, you have
millions of inhabitants that you could turn
to lawful industry, you are blessed with
harbours where your fleets of commerce
may ride in safety, and your isle, by the
hand of Providence, is better situated for

Sir George Yonge said, he should oppose the Bill, because the present necessities of Ireland were created by her voting sums of money to government which they were unable to pay.

Lord Newhaven said, he should move early in the next session for the Import Bill to be brought in, not even excepting sugars, though he found the noble lord was inclined to give it up.

Mr. Gilbert said, he should propose an enquiry into the trade of both countries, before he voted for any more commercial Bills at all.*

* 66

between the supporters and opposers of the In consequence of some compromise Irish Bills, although the former shewed great superiority of strength, it was notwithstanding thought necessary to give up, for the present, most of the advantages that were ori. ginally intended for that country. Some enlargement, however, was given to the linen trade, particularly in the article of checks; and India trades which did not before exist. Thus some openings given in the African and West the measure, at its final transit through parliament, might be rather considered as an opening to future service, and an earnest of good

« ElőzőTovább »