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work shall be accomplished. Of a truth, prepared to answer what had been so ably sceptres are most chiefly to be envied for and so eloquently advanced on subjects of that they bestow the power of thus con- such vast extent and such deep importquering and ruling thus. It was the boast ance. By allowing time for meditation, of Augustus—it formed part of the lustre and for collecting and marshalling their in which the perfidies of his earlier years thoughts, the House would be better able were lost—that he found Rome of brick, to come to a correct conclusion on a future and left it of marble; a praise not un- day. It would not be supposed for a worthy a great prince, and to which the moment that he meant to contend that the present reign is not without claims. But law in this country had arrived at such a how much nobler will be our Sovereign's degree of perfection, as to be incapable of boast, when he shall have it to say, that further improvement; but he hoped that he found law dear, and left it cheap; hon. members would keep their minds in found it a sealed book-left it a living suspense, until the time for discussion letter; found it the patrimony of the rich arrived. He would therefore move, that -left it the inheritance of the poor ; found the debate be adjourned. it the two-edged sword of craft and op- Mr. Brougham concurred in the propression_left it the staff of honesty and priety of an adjournment till to-morrow the shield of innocence! To me, much fortnight. reflecting on these things, it has always Mr. Secretary Peel said :- I cannot, Sir, seemed a worthier honour to be the instru- allow the present occasion to pass without ment of making you bestir yourselves in offering a few words. I rejoice that the hon. this high matter, than to enjoy all that and learned member concurs in the propriety office can bestow-office, of which the of the proposal for an adjournment; and patronage would be an irksome incum- it will render it unnecessary for me at brance, the emoluinents superfluous to one present to enter into any detailed discuswho had rather, with the rest of his indus- sion. Independently of those difficulties, trious fellow-citizens, make his own hands under which, under any circumstances, i minister to his wants ; and as for the must have laboured, from want of profespower supposed to follow it-I have lived sional knowledge and professional habits, half a century, and I have seen that power I am sure the House will readily believe, and place may be severed. But one power that the occupation in which I have been I do prize: that of being the advocate of engaged for the last few days, has tended my countrymen here, and their fellow still further to incapacitate me for the task labourer elsewhere, in those things which of discussion at present. I can only speak, concern the best interests of mankind. therefore, rather of the spirit in which the That

power, I know full well, no govern- proposition is made, than attempt to follow ment can give—no change take away! the hon. and learned gentleman, who has

I move you, Sir, “ That an humble gone through his great subject with such Address be presented to his Majesty, patience and investigation, and such ability praying that he will graciously be pleased of illustration. I fully concur in the to issue a Commission for inquiring into opinion, that it would be unwise to arrive the defects, occasioned by time and other- now at a precipitate but conclusive vote; wise, in the Laws of this realm of Eng- and I think the hon. and learned gentleland, as administered in the Courts of man must himself perceive, that the terms Common Law, and the remedies which of his motion are so general, that it is immay be expedient for the same.”

possible from thence to form any precise The Solicitor General said, that at that notion of the nature of the reforms which late hour the House would little expect of he would introduce. I do not mean to him, that he should follow his hon. and quarrel with the generality of those terms; learned friend through the patient, long, but until the explanation of to-night, speand elaborate, detail, into which he had culation as their precise object was rather entered. It seemed to him that the House calculated to mislead. Hence an addiwould arrive-if not at as speedy, at least tional reason is afforded for not calling at a more safe conclusion-if it allowed upon the House at present to express any itself time for reflection, by a short ad distinct opinion. The hon. and learned journment of the present debate. It would gentleman's notice referred to certain rebe an ill compliment to his hon. and forms in the law, and its administration in learned friend, if he were to affect to be the courts, as time had rendered necessary or as experience had shewn to be expedi- reform. Still less am I inclined to shew ent; and to the principle of such reforms, any peculiar attachment to the number I am almost the last person in the House “twelve” for the judges; or to resist any to object. I have myself attempted to proposition for an inquiry whether they proceed upon it in the amelioration which ought not to be increased, for the better I have attempted of the Criminal law. I administration of public justice. I believe found benefit of clergy and various other there have been periods when the number institutions—no doubt, wise at the time of judges was more than twelve, and it they were introduced-unfit for present may, for aught I know, be very fit to circumstances, and that a change was ne- revert to that practice. The hon. and cessary. I did not hesitate to propose that learned gentleman certainly mistakes my change; and for this reason—I could not view, if he supposes I am disposed to shew hold prescription as a sufficient ground, peculiar attachment to the particular why we should not inquire, calmly and number at present existing, even if in deliberately, what alterations experience former times that number had not been had proved to be expedient.

greater. But I am unwilling, Sir, that the Into all the latter part of the hon. and House should now express any positive learned member's speech, I profess myself opinion upon this point. If I understand

I wholly unable to enter : but upon one or the hon. and learned gentleman right, he two points connected with the constitu- would add one judge to the court of Comtion of our courts, I will say a few words. mon Pleas, and one to the court of King's I am now prepared to express my appro- Bench, making five to each court; and he bation of the principle of much that fell would cause the judges who did the outfrom the hon. and learned member. He of-door work to be placed in rotation. If adverted, among other things, to the pro- this was not the case, I should have a priety of equalising the business in the strong objection to any measure which went three courts of justice ; and he pointed out to make any one judge less respectable the advantages to be derived, if the courts than another; and I could never consent of Exchequer, Common Pleas, and King's to make, in any manner, one of those Bench, could be really and practically put judges who are to preside in a criminal on an equality, as to the transaction of court less respectable--[Mr. Brougham business. Surely, every one must concur said, across the table, it was his intention in the principle, if it can be carried into that the judges should take the out-of-door effect." As to the mode in which that work in rotation). I therefore, Sir, shall principle can be so carried into effect, I am not object, if the judges cannot now get not prepared to express an opinion. The through the business, that it should be hon. and learned member also referred to facilitated by having five judges in a the sort of monopoly established in the court. court of Common Pleas, by confining the There is another point to which I will practice to serjeants. I believe that refer, and one on which, I am afraid, I point has engaged the attention of the should be induced to differ from the hon. present lord Chancellor, and that the and learned gentleman. He recommends eminent judge who presides in that court that the judges should be paid by fees; is not indisposed to a change. Again, as but I much doubt the wisdom of this to the Exchequer, where, it seems, the opinion. The learned gentleman says, he power of instituting a suit is confined to would control the fees, and give the the clerks of the court-guarding against judges only a certain and a qualified ininjury to vested interests, it may be very terest in them, but sufficient to secure their fit to inquire whether it would not be attention to their duty, and to promote the right to open a more extensive system of despatch of business. But I am disposed practice. I am quite sure the House will to think, that much of the deference paid perceive, that the fear of doing injury even to the judges depends on their dignity; to vested interests ought not to prevent it that much of the impression which they from adopting important improvements. make on the public mind, much of the Compensation may be granted, or the respect paid them by the people, particuvested interest may be permitted to expire larly by the lower classes of the people, with the life of the present holder of any depended on the opinion of their purity. appointment; but this consideration ought I should be sorry to hazard this, by giving pot to obstruct any necessary or wholesome I them an interest in despatching causes i , State of the Courts of Common Law. 252 and I think the advantages which might | ever presided in the court of King's-bench, be obtained by procuring a little more des- and chief baron Thompson, who has patch of business, would not be com- gained the respect of every man; it does pensated by the evil arising from giving so happen, Sir, that these two judges, the the judge an interest, of any kind, in causes. only two referred to by the hon. and The judge would either be induced by it learned gentleman, were promoted, from to do more business, or he would not; if being puisne judges. Would it not have he were not induced to do more business, been an injustice to those excellent men, and no advantage would result from the would not the public service have suffered change; if he were induced to do more a serious injury, if those judges had not business, it might be suspected that he been promoted ; particularly in the case made too much despatch, and that im- of lord Tenterden, who had not risen to pression of respect which he now excited such eminence as an advocate, as to have might be lost. Might not the party who was necessarily inferred, that he was to become dissatisfied with his decision think his case an eminent judge ? The hon. and learned had not been sufficiently inquired into ?- gentleman's own instances shew that an that it had not engaged enough of the invariable adherence to the rule which he judge's 'attention, who had been more eager recommends would operate as a hardship to obtain fees by the despatch of business, on individuals, and be a detriment to the than to do justice? I think, Sir, under public. the present system, the substitution of fees With respect to fixing the terms, so that for a salary to the judges, would not the holidays and the times of business shall answer the learned gentleman's expecta- recur periodically; there are two terms altions; and that the only advantage arising ready invariable, and I do not know why from it—the despatch of a little more we should not have four, I do not know business—would not compensate the evil why members of parliament should not be of the impression which would be made able to foresee when they must attend on the minds of the public by the judges their business in the country. I see no taking fees.

reason for adhering to a system which There is another point, Sir, on which I makes two terms moveable, and two fixed; cannot agree with the hon, and learned and I think it would be advisable to make all gentleman. He argues for a strict ad- the four fixed. For why should we have herence to the rule, that a puisne judge two fixed, and two dependent on the moon ? should not be promoted to a higher seat Another point to which the learned on the bench. I agree with him, Sir, that gentleman has referred is the salary of the as a general rule, it is a good one; but if judge of the Admiralty court, which in it were invariably and rigidly adhered to, peace is only 2,500l. per year, and in war, it would sometimes lead to the commission may amount to between ten and eleven of great injustice towards individuals, and thousand. Now, Sir, I do not know why inflict a serious injury on the public service. the fees of these judges should not be To say that a puisne judge, however up- abolished, and an equal salary given them, rightly he may conduct himself

, however both in peace and war. The public will high may be his character for independence not suffer by that change, and the judge and honour, however much he may adorn will not be injured. There is another the judicial seat—to say that such a man point on which I will just say a few words ; was never to be promoted, is, in my opi- namely, the number of appeals before the nion, neither wise nor just. I agree with Privy Council. No doubt the learned the learned gentleman, that to promote a gentleman has drawn his information from puisne judge, on account of his subser- papers laid on the table of the House; viency to the Crown, would be an erro- but I think he has drawn an erroneous neous proceeding; but I cannot agree conclusion, as to the delay of business, with him, that we ought rigidly to adhere and the quantity of business not transto the rule, never to promote a puisne acted, from those documents. He thinks judge. It does so happen, Sir, that in the that not more than forty cases out of the speech which the learned gentleman has five hundred and ten appeals which have just delivered, the two judges on whom he been made from the East and West Indies, has passed a just and well-merited pane- and from Guernsey and Jersey, have gyric-lord Tenterden, whom he has been decided. The learned gentlecharacterised as one of the ablestjudges that man has collected this information from the returns, but those returns include all recommendation of magistrates for Ireland, the cases which have been compromised that would, I think, be much better than or settled abroad, and being left on the the present method, by which the lord list, lead to an erroneous conclusion. The chancellor of Ireland has to collect the five hundred and ten cases also included opinions of several individuals. Any memappeals from Guernsey and Jersey, which ber of the Privy Council may recommend were only for summonses. In many of us a gentleman as justice of peace in Irethose which are sent from the East Indies land. Formerly, the lord chancellor asked to this country, there is no agent appoint- the members of the county to recommend ed to carry them on, and they cannot be justices; but that practice is altered, and I brought forward for decision. I admit am disposed to think, as we must have the that the appeals from the East Indies are recommendation of some local authority, of very great importance; and the prac- that no better than that of the lord lieutice of carrying them before the Privy tenant and custos rotulorum can be deCouncil is one which may require examin- vised. ation. Out of the appeals made to the With respect to the licensing system, Privy Council since 1800, eighty-two have to which the learned gentleman has rebeen from the East Indies, and in ferred, he does not seem to be aware that fifty-three of them no agent has ap- a bill was brought into this House last peared on either side. In sixty-seven session, though it was not passed, for instances no case has been drawn up checking abuses in that system. It is either by the appellant or appellee ; thus generally found, I believe, that the abuses of the eighty-two cases nominally before of that system are more prevalent in large the Privy Council, in sixty-seven there was towns and in their neighbourhood. The no case submitted to it, and it was impos- brewers, at least, generally reside in large sible that it should proceed to adjudica- towns; and there lies their influence. tion. When cases are not complete, the Now, one of the provisions of the bill, to council has no means of proceeding. The which I have alluded, was to provide a native of India, perhaps, does not know remedy for this evil; which it did by givthat it is necessary, in sending an appealing, wherever the magistrates of such to this country, that he should appoint an towns had an exclusive jurisdiction, the agent : he does not know, perhaps, the county magistrates a concurrent jurisdicmeans of carrying on his appeal; which tion, as far as licensing was concerned. makes the whole subject of considerable I admit, that the system requires correcimportance, and deserving of attention and tion; and the bill of last session was only inquiry.

postponed to give a fuller opportunity of There is another point in the learned discussing the measure and finding out the gentleman's speech, to which I wish to re- best means of facilitating justice, by introfer; namely, that which relates to the ap- ducing publicity into the licensing syspointment of justices of the peace. The tem. learned gentleman doubts the propriety of The learned member, Sir, has referred the appointment being made at the recom- to one of the bills which I introduced last mendation of the lord lieutenant, or rather session, which regulates the fees of the of the custos rotulorum; to whom the re- magistrates' clerks, and which he accuses commendation, in fact, belongs. But it of adding to contention. That bill gave is not possible for any authority in this direct authority to the magistrates on the metropolis to appoint justices of the peace bench to refuse costs in cases of assault. for distant places, without the recommen- I abstained from giving expenses in cases dation of some local authority: and it of assault, precisely because I would not does appear to me, that the nobleman who encourage frivolous proceedings. If it be is custos rotulorum, being generally also right to give costs in cases of rape, I see lord lieutenant, is the most unexception- no reason why they should not be given able officer we can have to give such a re- in cases of attempt at rape. The distinccommendation. The duty must be de- tion which formerly existed was between volved on some local authority, and I think felony and misdemeanour; and the bill no better than that of the custus rotulorum gave authority to the magistrates to allow can be devised. If the opinion of one parties their expenses in such cases of gentleman or nobleman, responsible like a misdemeanour as they might think fit. I lord lieutenant, could be obtained, in the have heard no complaints of that law. If

I had, I should have no objection to have to think that his object would not be obit altered.

tained ; for a commission would be conI have heard, Sir, with satisfaction, that fused and overwhelmed by the multipliall the bills which I introduced have worked city of the objects. The learned gentlewell; and I hold in my hand the five acts man has evidently brought forward his which I introduced comprised in one small motion, not with the view to subvert, but volume; and it contains not only an enu- to improve the law; he has taken the wise meration of all the acts which those five course of pointing out its evils, many of acts repealed, but the substance of what which I do not deny, and he seeks a pracwas before spread over one hundred and tical remedy. The manner in which he thirty acts of parliament. In this, Sir, I has brought forward his motion is well find great encouragement to proceed; and calculated to gain favour for his proposiI do not despair of effecting great good of tion : but, before I agree to it, I wish to

I the same kind, from seeing the small com- have time to consult those who, from their pass into which those hundred and thirty station and attainments, are best qualified acts have been compressed. With the to judge—I mean the lord Chancellor and exception of the observation of the learned the Attorney-general; and I trust the

I gentleman, I have never heard the least learned gentleman will give us a few days complaint of those five acts. They have to take into our consideration the various now been in operation for nine months, subjects which he has brought before the and they have not given rise to any doubts House. If he then finds that we are not concerning their meaning. I was told at prepared to go his length, he may appeal the Home office, during the administra- to the House. I can assure the learned tion of lord Lansdowne, that no complaints gentleman, that in asking for delay, I do had been made, and that there was nothing not wish to defeat his object, nor to dein those laws which called for correction. prive him of that honest fame which is I say this, not taking credit to myself, but due to him for having originated such a giving it to those gentlemen who were motion. employed about the technical parts of the Mr. Wynn said, that after so long and bills, and by whom they were, in fact, so laborious a speech as that which the prepared.

House had just heard, it was but reasonThe learned gentleman has also referred able that time should be given for conto the appeals from the magistrates. To sidering the various topics referred to. his observations on this point, I reply that His object in rising was merely to enter

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power of appeal from all con- into a short explanation. With respect victions by one magistrate, however small to the appeals before the Privy Council, the sum; and I gave a power of appeal the reason why a greater number were not from the decision of two, whenever the disposed of was, because there were no fine amounted to 5l., or the term of im- agents or parties before the Privy Council, prisonment exceeded one month. I have whom they could hear. Now this, he apbeen desirous to make these few observa- prehended, arose from the different mantions, Sir, on the more popular parts of ner in which appeals from the inferior the learned gentleman's statement. The courts of Judicature to the superior were remainder of his observations, relating to disposed of in this country and in India. real property, and to the various legal The course pursued in India was in every points connected with it, is so full of tech- respect more summary than in this counnical details, that I am not prepared to try. In India, the cause was removed enter into a consideration of it, and I wish altogether from the inferior to the superior to avoid pledging myself, I wish the court, the whole being embodied in the House to abstain from pledging itself- written pleadings and arguments of counsel, to come to any conclusion, until after a and out of these the court of Appeal made few days consideration.

It is necessary it a practice never to travel, without to take time for consideration before we calling for any fresh lights upon the subcan decide which are the most important (ject, whether the judgment given was points, in the many things to which the right or wrong. Perhaps the inhabitants learned gentleman has alluded, for a com- of India were a little disappointed that the mission to take up. If every thing men- same course was not pursued here in this tioned by the learned gentleman were to country. Indeed he had reason to know be referred to a commission, I am inclined that some discontent had been felt upon

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