KEIGHTLEY'S view of the grammar, would be the reverse of what is plainly intended. "Say what doth concern your coming," without an interrogation, means, "What bears on your visit?" This is sense; but, I apprehend, clearly not what Shakespeare meant. He meant, "Why are you come?" "what does your visit relate to ?" The order is, "What doth your coming concern?" Not "quod attinet ad," but " ad quod attinet?" In almost all the other cases, MR. KEIGHTLEY'S construction requires us to understand, "Say is so and so" to be equivalent in grammar as well as meaning to "Say if so and so is"; which I conceive is untenable. The passage from Hamlet must be even more strained. The question, "What from our brother?" is quite simple; but it is very far from simple, according to usage, to make "Say what from him" mean (grammatically) "Say what" (news has come) "from him."

When a connecting conjunction does appear, as in the second passage from the Two Gentlemen of Verona, no doubt MR. KEIGHTLEY's construction is much less unnatural. "Tell me, whither were I best," may stand for "whither I were." But the direct question is much the most obvious, and nothing at all is gained by superseding it. In all these cases the two parts of the sentence are in simple apposition. LYTTELTON.

COMMATICE.

(2nd S. iii. 188; 4th S. ii. 392, 452.) The three words comma, commaticus, and commatice, occur more than once in St. Jerome. Let me give the references:

1. Comma.-"A supradicto versu, usque ad finem libri parvum comma, quod remanet, prosa oratione contexitur."-Præf. in Lib. Job.

Again :

"Nemo cum prophetas versibus viderit esse descriptos, metro eos existimet apud Hebræos ligari, et aliquid simile habere de psalmis et operibus Salomonis; sed quod in Demosthene et in Tullio solet fieri, ut per cola scribantur et Commata."—Præf. in transl. Esaiæ, ad Paulam et Eustochium.

Marianus Victorius Reatinus, the editor of the edition I use (Antwerp, 1578), thus gives the "Argument" of the above preface: "Postquam explicavit prophetas per cola, commataque, non metro describi," &c. Again, that father writes: Legite igitur et hunc juxta translationem nostram; quoniam per cola scriptus et commata, manifestiorem legentibus sensum tribuit."-Præf. in Ezechielem.) I may say that these "prefaces are not those prefixed to the different books expounded, but gathered together in the third volume of my edition, among his epistles.. The

“ κώλον membrum : κόμμα incisio. In oratione cola sunt ubi sensus perfectus est, commata ubi imperfectus; perfecta enim oratio membris constat, imperfecta commatibus. Sunt enim commata velut juncturæ in brachiis, cola vera ipsa brachia."

I may add that Scaliger has a whole chapter of three closely printed pages on the above words. (Poetices, lib. iv. c. 25.)

The

2. Commaticus. "Osee (Hosea) commaticus est, et quasi per sententias loquens." (Præf. in duod. proph. ad Paulam et Eustochium.) meaning is evidently abrupt, sententious—a style of short sentences. Again, he thus speaks of Theotimus, Bishop of Scythia :-"In morem dialogorum et veteris eloquentiæ breves, commaticosque tractatus edidit.' (Catal. Script. Eccl.) Robert Stephan, in his Latin Thesaurus, gives "brevis as the meaning of commaticus, adding as examples "hymnus commaticus" (Sidon. iv. 3), "pronunciatio commatica" (Cael. Rhod. xxvii. 7. Liddell and Scott give, as the meaning of the Greek word, 66 consisting of single or short clauses."

3. Commatice.-I rather think that this word occurs somewhere in St. Jerome's Epistles, though I am not sure. But the passage of which your correspondent is in search will be found in that father's Commentary on St. Matthew, in his exposition of the 25th chapter, the parable of the ten virgins. It is as follows:

"Prudentem semper admoneo lectorem, ut non superstitiosis acquiescat interpretationibus, et quæ commatice, pro fingentium dicuntur arbitrio; sed considera priora, media, et sequentia, et nectat sibi universa quæ scripta sunt."

The meaning is obvious. Contextual, in opposition to fragmentary criticism, is what he recom mends. HORATIUS BONAR. Edinburgh.

OLD PAPER. (4th S. ii. 396, 475.)

I beg to tender my best thanks to HERMENTRUDE for her kind suggestion about gold beaters' skin. Perhaps I am fastidious, but I confess I have a feeling against goldbeaters' skin, as I have been told that it is the skin of the men who beat gold. However, I shall not forget a good hint, although I am indebted to the Editor for a private letter on the same subject. The MSS. of which I spoke are not of any great historical value, although they are worth preserving. They are mostly diaries kept by some of my ancestors and their connexions both in America and in London, from 1767 to 1780, which was the period of the revolutionary war, when the colonies were lost to the mother country. Fortunately the most im

portant diary, kept by a governor of one of the New England provinces, is in the best preservation and needs no repair. In the others, I wish the entries had more often been less personal, and that they had more fully referred to the great events which were then passing. A few years before this time, the mob in one of the large cities broke into the governor's house and destroyed a quantity of interesting historical collections, amongst which was the diary of Colonel Goffe, the regicide, which he kept during the time he was a fugitive in Connecticut and other places. Of late years these valuable collections have been eagerly asked for by Americans, who have been loth to believe that such was their fate. But from books printed soon after, and from contemporary MS. sources, it is very easy to prove so disagreeable a fact. What remains of a date so near that period it is the more necessary to take care of. What is lost is gone; what remains may be preserved. I have been experimenting on one or two of the leaves by painting them over with a warm and rather weak solution of isinglass put on with a broad camel-hair brush. I found it necessary to hold them up in a suspended position to dry and harden at once before the fire, and then do the other side; for though they were rotten and loose enough in texture when dry, they were ten times worse when wet. If they were laid down on a flat surface to dry of themselves, they were in danger of adhering, and it was of course very difficult to detach them without injury. In short, as far as I have gone, I have found it best to do one side and immediately dry it, by which an increased amount of strength has been given to the paper, and then take the second side in the same way. It might be feared that this process would damage the writing and make it run. This fear made me cautious. I do not, however, see any indications of running or blurr on those pages which I have so treated. Of course modern writing would not stand it, but in old writing there appears to be very little to run. This process may answer in certain cases, though it is not so efficient as the one kindly pointed out to me by the Editor, nor so complete as that meutioned by HERMENTRUDE, if it were not for sacrificing those unhappy men alluded to above.

P. HUTCHINSON.

And has S. REDMOND forgotten Gen. iii. 21 ?— "Unto Adam also and to his wife the Lord God made

coats of skins, and clothed them."

Of course on that occasion a woman must have had a coat.

In Scottish literature the word is also used in

this way, as in the title of an old song, the music of which is in the Skene MS. (a well-known and ancient compilation), part 6, the 8th tune:— "Kilt thy coat, Magge, kilt thy coatie." JAMES MASON.

London.

There is here no difficulty. Whatever be the ultimate etymology of the word, which is the French cotte, Italian cotta, German kutte, it implies a covering. There is no reason for restricting it to male dress, except that it is now customary to do so. We still apply it widely when we speak of a coat of plaster, or of a pony having a rough coat. In early English it is much more frequently applied to male than to female attire. The following are a few examples of the latter use:

"This was her cote, and her mantele."

Chaucer, Rom. of the Rose, 459. "And she hadd on a cote of grene.”—Ibid. 573. "How Heyne hath a new cote, and his wif another." Piers Plowman, A. v. 91. "I have put off my coat; how shall I put it on?" The Bible (Authorised Version), Sol. Song, v. 3. "The cote-hardie was also worn by the ladies in this reign | Edw. III.]."-British Costume, p. 133.

The first, second, and fourth examples are given in that excellent book entitled The Bible WordBook. The word gown is, on the other hand, very frequently used of male attire, as in Chaucer. So also in Piers Plowman, ed. Wright, p. 259. And Stow says, anno 1507:

IS IT PROPER ?

(4th S. ii. 486.)

In reply to S. REDMOND, coat (root Esthonian, kattan, to cover, to clothe) does not appear to be applied in modern times to women's dress, though petticoat (French, petite cotte, little coat) is common enough. But in old writers it is frequently used in the same sense as in the passage to which

sables, the which goune was valued at 15007." We still have gownsmen in plenty. WALTER W. SKEAT.

1, Cintra Terrace, Cambridge.

In the will of Jane Aske, of London, widow, 1666, is the following bequest: "Vnto my daughter in Law Anne Aske afore-named, my morning coate." At an earlier date the ladies seem to have

their meals with him, but sent him away with a few groschens in his pocket, which caused the grateful wanderer to exclaim, "God bless you! you have made a man of me!" Hence, the Germans say, originated the saying. The story is rational, true to nature, and may be a fact. At any rate, it is more to the purpose than the fanciful idea of the Rev. W. S. Blackley, M.A., quoted in "N. & Q." at the above reference. As connected with this subject, Orator Henley's witticism may be quoted, that a tailor was not a man, because we are told that "no man putteth a new piece on an old garment"; "which," said Henley, "tailors do every day." This " argumentum ad hominem" is one with which few commentators will coincide.

When Foote printed his The Tailors: a tragedy for warm weather-now better known as Quadrupeds-his title-page motto was, "Hail! sacred nine"; from whence taken I know not. The proverb or saying "thirteen to the dozen," is by the Italians connected with a tailor whose misadventure figures in an old Venetian story, said to be an historical fact. In Duncombe's British Theatre may be found a farce, by H. Millner, on the subject, called Thirteen to the Dozen; or, the Tailor of Venice. It was acted at one of the minor theatres, and had a long run. Mr. Buckstone (then just coming out) was the tailor. Unless the old joke can be explained by the German story, it appears to me a very senseless one. A tailor is as manly, intelligent, and respectable as is a tradesman of any other class. Many examples can be given of tailors whose after-career has been eminent and distinguished. The late Francis Place, the political writer and reviewer, was a tailor to the end of his days; Dignum, the famous singer and clever comedian, was in early life a tailor;

and so was President Johnson. The list could be increased to a great extent.

From tailors the transit is easy to goose." Doctor Johnson is at fault here in his Dictionary. We have first, "goose, plural geese"; then follow the definitions of the bird, and of a "tailor's smoothing iron." No other plural is given. The plural of the smoothing iron is however not geese," but "gooses." No tailor would say "I have two geese"; the phrase would be "I have two gooses." * STEPHEN JACKSON.

66

* After_the_production of the Sadler's Wells pantomime Mother Goose, worsted stockings, or rather "socks," were sold, called gooses-they were so named from being the same colour as the goose's feet, or, perhaps, the stockings of the heroine. In this case gooses was evidently the proper name. A" pair of geese" would have astonished a hosier! Such a demand would have been more suitable for a shop in "the Poultry." I once purchased a pair of gooses." The name is now, I suppose, numbered amongst "the things that were.'

66

The origin of this saying has been already discussed in "N. & Q." (1st S. vi. 390, 563, and vii. 165, 557.) It will be seen by the first of these references that the idea of its having been derived from the number of strokes upon the bell announcing the death of a man is not new. The derivation of tailors from tellers or tail is ingenious, but how shall we account for the existence of a similar saying in Brittany and Normandy, and perhaps elsewhere. (1st S. vii. 557.) Is it not more likely that it has taken its origin from the custom so common among the poor, of apprenticing their weakly and deformed children to this trade, especially in the rural districts, where there is no great choice of employment? The ablebodied labourer and robust country lass look down upon these frail specimens of humanity, and the saying has become a standard joke with them. E. M'C.

Guernsey.

CROSS-LEGGED EFFIGIES AND THE CRUSADERS (3rd S. viii. 312; 4th S. ii. 392, 446, 535.) — If ANGLO-SCOTUS had quoted in extenso the passage in Barbour to which he refers (lib. xx. 585), he would have shown that the tomb in St. Bride's kirk at Douglas was undoubtedly that of the Good Sir James. The poet, after describing his death, goes on to say

"And the banys honourabilly

In till the kirk of Douglas war
Erdyt with dull and mechill car,
Thyer Archibald sune girt syne
Of Albastre baith fair and fine,
Ordaine a tomb sa richly

As it behowt to swa worthy." The fourth line is evidently corrupt, the sure and syne making evident nonsense. It should probably stand

"Sir Archibald his son girt syne," as we know that Sir Archibald rebuilt the church in 1390.

It is perfectly true that it is also the tomb of Sir James de Laudonia, father of the Black Knight of Liddesdale, for the simple reason that he is no other person than the Good Sir James himself.

ANGLO-SCOTUS has totally misunderstood the reference to Salisbury Cathedral. No one denies that many of the cross-legged monuments are those of Crusaders; but the question is, was the attitude adopted because they were so? Although it is described as cross-legged, it certainly never conveyed to my mind any idea of the Holy Cross, which might be so much more reverently indicated in many ways.

As crossing the feet is a common action when sitting, it would, in the case of an erect or recumbent figure, be no inappropriate way to expressing symbolically that the person represented was en

titled-sedere in judicio. It would appear that the fashion of these cross-legged figures went out before the last of the Crusades. GEORGE VERE IRVING.

ARCHBISHOP KING'S MONUMENT (4th S. ii. 415.) I am sorry to inform your correspondent C. S. K. that there is not any monument over the grave of Archbishop King in the old churchyard of Donnybrook, nor any memorial of him in the present parish church. But, strange as this neglect of the memory of so bright an ornament of the Irish church may appear, it is not singular, as the following paragraph will suffice to prove:

"Archbishop King died May 8, 1729, and was buried in the churchyard of Donnybrook [on the north side, as he had directed]; but no monument or other memorial of him can now be found there. Archbishop Magee [whose

grandson is the newly appointed Bishop of Peterborough] died August 19, 1831, and was buried in the old churchyard of Rathfarnham, likewise not far from Dublin. His

tomb stands exactly in the centre of the ancient church; but as no inscription has been placed on it, the spot will ere long be forgotten. This treatment appears somewhat strange in connexion with two of the ablest and greatest of the archbishops of Dublin. It ought, one would think, to be corrected; and yet perhaps Sir William Jones' plan

is the wisest: The best monument that can be erected

to a man of literary talents is a good edition of his

works.'"

In the parish register of Donnybrook this concise entry appears :·

"Buried, Archbishop King, May 10th, 1729."

If C. S. K. desires further information regarding this distinguished prelate, let me refer him to sundry volumes of "N. & Q.," and to Brief Sketches of the Parishes of Booterstown and Donnybrook, pp. 73, 164 (Dublin, 1861).

A memorial window, even after the lapse of nearly a century and a half, would not be inappropriate. The idea was entertained some years since, but was not carried out; and it is a matter which, I think, may fairly claim the attention of the present rector of Donnybrook. If properly undertaken it could not prove a failure.

ABHBA.

MILTON AND PHILARAS (4th S. ii. 466.) — Leonard Philaras was a learned Athenian, who resided at the court of Paris as ambassador from

the Duke of Parma. In testimony of his admiration for Milton's defence of the Commonwealth, he transmitted his portrait to its author, accompanied by a panegyrical epistle. This may have been in Greek, but I am not aware that it is extant. Philaras shortly after made a journey to England, with the chief, if not the sole, object of visiting Milton-then in a state of total blindness. On his return to Paris, it occurred to him that his friend might derive benefit from the advice and treatment of the celebrated surgeon and oculist Thevenot; and he accordingly wrote to Milton, inviting him to describe his symptoms, and sug

gesting the possibility of the recovery of his sight. This letter, which is probably not extant, was doubtless written in Latin; as Milton's noble reply to it, as also his previous acknowledgment of the portrait and eulogy, were written in that "lingua communis eruditorum." These two letters, with their translations, are given by Symmons in his Life of Milton, 8vo, 1810, p. 375. The latter letter (the fifteenth of Milton's Latin epistles) has been translated by Richardson and Hayley, and is given, in the version of the latter, by the Rev. H. J. Todd in his Some Account of the Life and Writings of John Milton, 8vo, 1826, p. 146. WILLIAM BATES.

Birmingham.

MOTHER OF ANTHONY GREY (4th S. i. 341.)-I am obliged to your correspondent for his information. When the clue is given, there is abundance of corroborative evidence. The marriage of George Grey and Margaret Salvin appears in the pedigree in Surtees's Durham; and the will of Gerard Salvin, wherein he mentions his sons-inlaw George Grey and Robert Rookby, is given in Wills and Inventories, vol. i. 345 (Surtees Society). E. H. A.

THOMAS BAKER (4th S. ii. 390.)-His copy of Walker's Sufferings of the Clergy was in possession of the Rev. W. N. Darnell, B.D., Rector of Stanhope, and sold at the sale in 1865.